Re: IDW is at the BAUT! « Reply #30 on Aug 7, 2007, 5:36pm »
I don't think IDW is an H.B. He's gone back and forth and in all sorts of directions -- among his claims have been, for instance, that Apollo 14 on were real, 11 was definitely faked, and something was fishy about 13.
What he is certain about, and willing to ague about, in relation to the Apollo Program is that there is something most people don't know. Something known only to extremely smart people like him, and experts who receive a salary specifically to prop up the official story and debunk the IDW's of the world.
Thus, he isn't wed to any particular version or element of a hoax theory. His only need is to never, ever be shown wrong.
Joined: Aug 2005 Gender: Male Posts: 104 Location: Centre of Universe (N.Z.)
Re: IDW is at the BAUT! « Reply #31 on Aug 8, 2007, 12:37am »
Quote:
His only need is to never, ever be shown wrong.
...and also that he must be able to understand everything.
Since he doesn't understand relativity (etc.) - and claims nobody else does, either - that then becomes "proof" that it's all a big hoax by persons of a certain religion, and that all physics since Newton is false.
Joined: May 2005 Gender: Male Posts: 2,274 Location: Dayton, Ohio
Re: IDW is at the BAUT! « Reply #33 on Aug 8, 2007, 8:28am »
Quote:
... and that all physics since Newton is false.
Unfortunately he doesn't understand Newton either. A couple years ago he couldn't solve some simple force equations because he got confused over the difference between mass and weight. When I tried to explain his mistake he became extremely obstinate, belligerent, and abusive. It all stemmed from the fact that his mistakenly solved equation gave him the answer he wanted and the correctly solved equation gave him the answer he didn’t want. His unique version of Newtonian physics therefore had to be the correct one.
Joined: May 2005 Gender: Male Posts: 885 Location: New Zealand
Re: IDW is at the BAUT! « Reply #34 on Aug 8, 2007, 9:57am »
To me, IDW summed up his problem her e, post 192, page 7: It's a means of personally demeaning someone... especially someone with my egocentric nature.
A big ego is probably the most selfish, controlling, disruptive, relationship-destroying, life-limiting, and dumb things that we can have. I've spent decades telling my ego to get out of my life because I'm runnning it and it's not, and the more I succeed the better life is. Anyone who allows their ego to trot them around by a ring in their snout, wherever and whenever it demands, is often impossible to get on with when their ego finds things a bit tough or not to its liking.
[Edited: Tried to fix gap in "here", without success. It doesn't appear on the Modify Post screen.]
Don't criticize what you can't understand. — Bob Dylan, “The Times They Are A-Changin'” (1963) Some people think they are thinking when they are really rearranging their prejudices and superstitions. — Edward R. Murrow (1908–65)
Re: IDW is at the BAUT! « Reply #35 on Aug 8, 2007, 12:37pm »
Appealing or alluding to highly theoretical concepts is a rather common method of ego reinforcement among conspiracy theorists. Theoretical physics is a popular playground for conspiracy theorists because it allows discussion of "deep" concepts without requiring much in the way of empirical verification or falsification. In the theoretical branches of physics, a theory is likely to be opposed chiefly by a different theory.
Unfortunately the physics most favored by conspiracy theorists and the physics useful to engineers and scientists are similar only in that the word physics is applied to both. Knowledge of the theoretical aspects does not encompass or subsume knowledge of the mundane practical physics. One cannot read about muons, relativity, and the fundemental nature of gravity and assume that you can then talk about Newtonian dynamics, heat transfer, and open-channel fluid flow.
Practical physics is relentlessly empirical, and is the branch of physics most directly responsible for space flight. While one can be given a certain amount of handwaving leeway in theoretical physics, one does practical physics only by the numbers. One must demonstrate acquaintance the known qualitative and quantitative relationships upon which life-safe predictions and assurances are made. One cannot be assumed to know those facts simply because one is, or purports to be, "very smart."
Joined: May 2005 Gender: Male Posts: 2,274 Location: Dayton, Ohio
Re: IDW is at the BAUT! « Reply #37 on Aug 8, 2007, 4:10pm »
Quote:
I think I remember that; it was a thread on GLP where I learned about "slugs" and the different uses of "pound" in (non metric) physics.
Yep, that's probably it. I was using the user name BB in that thread.
IDW took pounds-mass times acceleration to get force. We explained that he needed to divide lbm by g to convert to slugs, which he seemed to have trouble understanding. The worse of it was that later on he started using metric units and insisted upon dividing kilograms by g to get mass. We then explained there was no need to divide by g because the kilogram is a unit of mass. That's when he became exceedingly obtuse. He became such a jerk about it that I think he may have been playing dumb on purpose just to provoke us.
Re: IDW is at the BAUT! « Reply #38 on Aug 8, 2007, 5:36pm »
Was this the infamous "Miles per hour" conversation? I thought that was someone else, who did some wonderland math to derive radiation dosage to theoretical astronaut from a given flux.
I do remember IDW stumbling on slugs, tho. He truly hated the concept. I don't think he ever grasped the difference between pounds (weight) and kilograms (mass). Heck, until that conversation I was fuzzy on it myself. (And maybe still am, some days.)
My comment about IDW being "extremely smart" was in the context of a paragraph describing the world from his point of view. A point of view I believe shared by many conspiracy theorists. It's an essential aspect to the make-up of most C.T.'s, I believe; this impression that while the "sheeple" are walking around in a daze, the theorist was alert enough and bright enough to notice "squibs" shooting out of the WTC, planes spewing chemtrails overhead, and Planet X hovering low on the horizon.
Joined: May 2005 Gender: Male Posts: 2,274 Location: Dayton, Ohio
Re: IDW is at the BAUT! « Reply #39 on Aug 8, 2007, 7:11pm »
Quote:
Was this the infamous "Miles per hour" conversation? I thought that was someone else, who did some wonderland math to derive radiation dosage to theoretical astronaut from a given flux.
I don’t remember that conversation specifically, though there was some discussion about radiation dosage. There was an electrical engineer (Bill EE) participating in the thread who was IDW’s main adversary during the radiation discussion.
One of the big topics of discussion was IDW’s contention that the LM wasn’t capable of withstanding the impact force of docking, specifically during Apollo 14 when they had the problem with the docking mechanism. I think it may have been during this conversation that we got into the mass vs. weight thingy.
Quote:
I do remember IDW stumbling on slugs, tho. He truly hated the concept. I don't think he ever grasped the difference between pounds (weight) and kilograms (mass). Heck, until that conversation I was fuzzy on it myself. (And maybe still am, some days.)
I learned something during that conversation as well – the definition of a poundal.
Re: IDW is at the BAUT! « Reply #40 on Aug 8, 2007, 10:26pm »
Yup. It was the docking clamp. IDW's idea was that the faster-than-intended Apollo 12 docking should have broken one of the spacecraft. The idea of shock absorbers didn't seem to come easily.
My favorite IDW moment, though, has to be the "full-metal-jacket" CRT tube. As in, he believed there to be a steel plate where the shadow mask sits. That would function as the anode for the electron beam...which would turn into photons on the other side of the steel plate.
"CRT Tube" indeed. Well, I'm going to let that stand. Hey, if it is good enough for "GNU..."
Joined: May 2005 Gender: Male Posts: 3,911 Location: Lost Deimos Moonbase
Re: IDW is at the BAUT! « Reply #41 on Aug 8, 2007, 10:27pm »
One of the big topics of discussion was IDW’s contention that the LM wasn’t capable of withstanding the impact force of docking, specifically during Apollo 14 when they had the problem with the docking mechanism. I think it may have been during this conversation that we got into the mass vs. weight thingy.
Yeah I think it was, along with people jumping off of chairs without smashing through the floor. IIRC he claimed that the CSM would smash through the LM when it attempted to dock with it.
It must be fun to lead a life completely unburdened by reality. -- JayUtah
"On two occasions, I have been asked, 'Pray, Mr. Babbage, if you put into the machine wrong figures, will the right answers come out?' I am not able to rightly apprehend the kind of confusion of ideas that could provoke such a question." -- Charles Babbage (1791-1871)
Re: IDW is at the BAUT! « Reply #42 on Aug 8, 2007, 11:18pm »
I went through a fairly detailed description of the LM's structural systems on that thread, to predictably no avail.
In the Kansas Cosmosphere you can see a naked lunar module. While some components such as the cabin walls are minimal skin and stringers, the structural system is actually composed of the two bulkheads of the mid-cabin space -- one forming the rear wall of the habitable volume behind the overhead hatch, and the other just behind the astronauts at their flight stations. They are joined in three places: the overhead docking assembly and two ventral beams to which the ascent-stage thrust structure is attached.
I've seen the overhead hatch assembly, and I have no problem believing I can drive my car over it without causing serious deformation. The LM was not just an aluminum beer can. It was seriously strong where it needed to be, but only where it needed to be. There weren't many redundant load paths. When you see the naked LM without its outer micrometeoroid and thermal shields, you get an idea for where it's strong and where it isn't. And the load-bearing structures are considerably strong.
Joined: May 2005 Gender: Male Posts: 2,274 Location: Dayton, Ohio
Re: IDW is at the BAUT! « Reply #43 on Aug 8, 2007, 11:52pm »
Quote:
The idea of shock absorbers didn't seem to come easily.
IDW eventually discovered that for himself and was real smug for learning something he thought the rest of us didn’t know. I then pointed out the post I made the previous day in which I specifically mentioned the shock attenuation system. He accused me of going back and editing my post even though I had no edit capability.
Quote:
…along with people jumping off of chairs without smashing through the floor.
That was me, except it was a desk. I calculated that the impact load of a LM-CSM docking was equivalent to the force of me hitting the floor after jumping off my desk.
Quote:
I went through a fairly detailed description of the LM's structural systems on that thread, to predictably no avail.
I recall that; it was interesting. You may have gotten nowhere with IDW but the rest of us appreciated your detailed explanations, as we always do.
Joined: Aug 2005 Gender: Male Posts: 104 Location: Centre of Universe (N.Z.)
Re: IDW is at the BAUT! « Reply #44 on Aug 25, 2007, 4:26pm »
I apologise, but gosh this made me laugh so much.
The latest from IDW at GLP:
Quote:
1)Light being bent by gravity means mass exists at light speed. Thats why Hawking is a vegetable with a majic wheelchair that talks for him, he is actually braindead and words that NOT his are simply being represented to the public as his own. He was on the verge of discarding EInstein.( and don't give me that quantum myth that 'photons' exist and possess 'apparent' mass, either!Not without PROOF!)
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