"If we can put a man on the Moon, we can build a computer made entirely of recycled paper." "Your flawed analogy only shows that other people can do other things." "Maybe you should call other people and ask how they do it." "Maybe they use good analogies."
Re: Doomsayer Environmentalists are Always Wrong « Result #8 Yesterday at 1:53pm »
Well, when you get down to it, the whole thing was a "status symbol." It also was a failure if addressing the dire predictions of AGW is a true measuring stick.
As I type this the world's players are scrambling to come up with a final communique that will put the best possible spin on what has been a very contentious 2 weeks in Copenhagen. I think talking about cleaning up the air is better than not talking but venues like Copenhagen, where there's unrealistic pressure to hammer out an accord in a couple of weeks, is not the way to go. More frequent discussions, without the pomp, is what needs to be done. One thing I got out of this summit is that the divide between the developed and developing countries is even larger than I thought.
*Edited because it seams eye kant spel thingz write sumtymes...
"If we can put a man on the Moon, we can build a computer made entirely of recycled paper." "Your flawed analogy only shows that other people can do other things." "Maybe you should call other people and ask how they do it." "Maybe they use good analogies."
'How shall a man judge what to do in such times?' 'As he ever has judged,' said Aragorn. 'Good and ill have not changed since yesteryear; nor are they one thing among Elves and Dwarves, and another among Men. It is a man's part to discern them, as much in the Golden Wood as in his own house.'
'How shall a man judge what to do in such times?' 'As he ever has judged,' said Aragorn. 'Good and ill have not changed since yesteryear; nor are they one thing among Elves and Dwarves, and another among Men. It is a man's part to discern them, as much in the Golden Wood as in his own house.'
lionking Uranus Formerly known as "star" and "lordoftherings" member is offline
Joined: Apr 2006 Gender: Female Posts: 1,615
Your best Christmas Song « Result #14 Yesterday at 7:09am »
I know I am a bit early but Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year for all of you. I might not be here in Beirut at Christmas time so I will start the thread now. I hope you had a nice year and you could achieve the goals you wanted.
Christmas is a very nice season to me.. it gathers the family and drives you to nice feelings.. with the snow and the cold outside while you being inside near the chimney watching and receiving guests. Children are happy receiving gifts [*sigh* those days went with no return]. Lights on the Christmas trees and many other brightful and colorful designing materials are so nice to see. I like so many Christmas songs. They bring me memories of the childhood. Sometimes we need to go back to innocence and take pleasure in such things like kids.I like 'Oh Christmas Tree' . It is a very nice song http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9_3ngTHs6gA
there are famous Carols: Deck the Halls, Joy to the World...
what is your favourite Christmas song? and what is Christmas to you?
Joined: May 2005 Gender: Male Posts: 3,951 Location: Lost Deimos Moonbase
Re: Doomsayer Environmentalists are Always Wrong « Result #15 Yesterday at 1:11am »
Watching the footage from Copenhagen, few of the "limos" are of the stretched variety, they are just the standard high powered salons that are considered limos (like this one I used in New York), so no rear facing seats or room for a moving boardroom. All they provide is a status symbol and likely a slightly more luxuious ride. They could have just as easily shaded the windows in a Prius and used that.
It must be fun to lead a life completely unburdened by reality. -- JayUtah
"On two occasions, I have been asked, 'Pray, Mr. Babbage, if you put into the machine wrong figures, will the right answers come out?' I am not able to rightly apprehend the kind of confusion of ideas that could provoke such a question." -- Charles Babbage (1791-1871)
Joined: May 2005 Gender: Male Posts: 1,861 Location: Space City, Texas
Re: Doomsayer Environmentalists are Always Wrong « Result #16 on Dec 17, 2009, 9:32pm »
This is a classic example of the dangerous difference between science and the "real" world. Science is about control and results. The world does not operate efficiently under strict control. The kind of controls that climate change politicians would have us impose will result in the concentration of economic power in fewer hands, vast rent seeking opportunities and wealth destruction.
From the Reason blog on the Copenhagen summit. Quote:
Rep. Markey also declared that the Waxman-Markey bill “is something that is going to create a technological revolution.” At his press conference the day before, Sen. John Kerry (D-Mass.), who is a co-sponsor of an energy and climate change bill in the Senate, similarly asserted, “Our bill is essentially a jobs bill.” Markey predicted that the scale of the changes sparked by congressional climate change legislation would exceed the telecommunications and Internet booms of the 1990s. So will new climate change policy spark a clean energy revolution?
Undoubtedly so, because they will be government supported or mandated jobs. Unfortunately they will also be jobs that will produce less wealth than private sector jobs and thus be reliant on government mandates to be protected. Any belief that jobs manufacturing wind turbines or solar panels will be maintained in the US and not farmed out overseas is folly. I see little reason to subsidized green jobs in China. Nor is there any reason that people who buy these things should pay additional taxes so the products can be made in the US.
So what? So what? This is what all those well-meaning young folks are campaigning for in the streets of Copenhagen. (Well, that and more money from their parents.) The campaign is not for the climate, but for more Mr.Zhaos. If left to themselves, those villagers would heat themselves through the bitter winter cold with coal. It takes a Mr.Zhao to take that coal away from them. Huang Qiufen has a vested interest in alternative energy. Her biggest threat: "the giant new coal-fired power station at the end of the road, which is supplying her former customers with electricity so they no longer need to tend their own hearths." Modern environmentalism and politics is about seeing that doesn't happen. Abundant electricity is to be seen as sinful; tending hearths of smoldering corn stalks, noble.
The Wall Street Journal today reports that "Corus, Europe's second-largest steel producer, is shuttering a giant U.K. steelmaking plant at Redcar, cutting 1,700 jobs." Because of the emissions trading scheme in place, Corus stands to make a $375 million windfall. As the article notes: "Corus is essentially being paid to lay off British workers." Whatever that is, it is certainly not about making life better. Modern environmentalism and politics have created a dangerous sanity inversion. We are now rewarding companies to shut down, put workers out of work, and produce less goods and services.--all so Mr. Zhao can be boss of the village, and, be jetted and chauffeured around the world.
No. This is the environmentalist equivalent of prayer - a way to do nothing but feel good about it.
So in the end I share (some of) Jason's feelings about the limos-in-Copenhagen issue for absolutely different reasons.
Actually, if you've read the whole thread you would see that my feelings on the matter are pretty close to your own. The Coppenhagen delegates are hypocrites of the false religion of climate change, because they don't even bother to say their prayers. I am not railing on them because I believe hybrid vehicles would have done any actual good, but because they fail to obey their own standards.
'How shall a man judge what to do in such times?' 'As he ever has judged,' said Aragorn. 'Good and ill have not changed since yesteryear; nor are they one thing among Elves and Dwarves, and another among Men. It is a man's part to discern them, as much in the Golden Wood as in his own house.'
Here is little story that will make all of us envious. Don't worry about all the carbon emissions from those limos and jets in Copenhagen. It looks like the Chinese have a plan that will compensate for it.
'How shall a man judge what to do in such times?' 'As he ever has judged,' said Aragorn. 'Good and ill have not changed since yesteryear; nor are they one thing among Elves and Dwarves, and another among Men. It is a man's part to discern them, as much in the Golden Wood as in his own house.'
yeah lets ridicule this group next..... hey slap my back again!! hey this is great !! we're really sockin it to them
Welcome to the forum.
yeah lets ridicule this group next
Ridicule is sometimes an appropriate response. This forum is not an academic presentation for guest lectures, it is a place where ideas are tested. Have you ever been to a doctoral candidates theses defense? They can be pretty rough and tumble tests of ideas.
hey slap my back again Praise of colleagues when they do excellent work is a good thing. We tend to be collegial here and will even offer praise when hoax believers do the right thing and acknowledge failed arguments.
we're really sockin it to them The intent of this forum is to vigorously debate the moon hoax. Sometime that properly requires a hard press on a claimant to get them to fully reveal what they mean. Particularly when the true agenda is unspoken. We are here to provide a record of moon hoax claims and the rebuttals to those claims. The more we get the hoax proponents to reveal, the more complete our rebuttal and the better we are meeting our purpose.
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This is what all those well-meaning young folks are campaigning for in the streets of Copenhagen. (Well, that and more money from their parents.) The campaign is not for the climate, but for more Mr.Zhaos. If left to themselves, those villagers would heat themselves through the bitter winter cold with coal. It takes a Mr.Zhao to take that coal away from them. Huang Qiufen has a vested interest in alternative energy. Her biggest threat: "the giant new coal-fired power station at the end of the road, which is supplying her former customers with electricity so they no longer need to tend their own hearths." Modern environmentalism and politics is about seeing that doesn't happen. Abundant electricity is to be seen as sinful; tending hearths of smoldering corn stalks, noble.
