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Post by hagbardceline on May 10, 2010 5:07:15 GMT -4
The hoax is not that they pretended to send people to the moon but really nobody has ever been there. I do not question the fact that we have been to the moon, in fact I find it very unlikely that people have never been there. What I question is that we first went to the moon at the time and using the methods and personnel that history claims we did. Do you understand why this sort of claim isn't convincing? You're not offering evidence for any alternative scenario at all, let alone one as well-documented as Apollo. And I'd really like you to explain the contradictory information about Van Allen radiation that you posted in your blog. I'll come to that soon. But you know I admit I can't prove that the Apollo Missions were faked. I can't prove that a space agency of the Illuminati-occupied govt of the City of London America Company... sorry, United States ;D... sent 12 men to the moon in chemical rockets, through a firing range of meteorids and a magnetron of radiation! I can't prove that it didn't happen. As you Skepmeisters love to say: you can't prove a negative. If somebody suggests that some pink unicorns in butterscotch winged chariots took Armstrong and Aldrin etc to the moon I can't prove that that didn't happen either. I just find both scenarioes unlikely. We're all dealing in possibilities here whether you like to think that or not.
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Post by hagbardceline on May 10, 2010 5:13:07 GMT -4
I don't know what planet they would use, but independent sources often relate that the Illuminati have mastered interstellar travel, and/or they have an allience with some of the Extraterrestrial civilizations who have as well. ;D ;D ;D You're joking, right? Do you really believe that is plausible? Yes. I'm not joking. We all get that from time to time. But I always answer them the same way: "You asked the question, this is my honest answer. Would you prefer me to lie?" They didn't fake actually going to the moon. They went to the moon alright. What I claim they faked was how and when they did it. No. The moon is the most likely location for the studio, if it was not on the Earth.
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Post by hagbardceline on May 10, 2010 5:17:56 GMT -4
I don't know what planet they would use, but independent sources often relate that the Illuminati have mastered interstellar travel...What sources? Name them. Put me in contact with them. You speak of "independent sources" and "insider witnesses" but you never name any of them or provide any means for anyone else to verify that they are who they claim to be. Without such verification, their testimony is fiction. There are some very interesting people like Stewart Swerdlow and Dr Bill Deagle, James Cabolt (a personal aquaintance of minhe). Phil Schneider, who provides physical evidence such as photoes of aliens and ET objects. Have I ever seen evidence from them? Like government documents? Blueprints of Schauberger and Tesla-powered craft; no. But I've never seen an Apollo LM on the moon either. There are teams of dedicated researchers, including myself, who are working to get the proper evidence of these kinds of activities.
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Post by hagbardceline on May 10, 2010 5:25:37 GMT -4
If they did use the moon as a location then it's likely that it all was. To clarify, because I'm not sure I understood that, you're agreeing that, if any of it was filmed on the Moon, it's most likely that all of it was? Yes I can clarify that. I suspect that all of footage was filmed on the moon, or a similar heavenly body. But sometimes Conspiracy Theories are reality. Do you want me to list Conspiracy Theories that later became fact: Watergate, MK Ultra, The Dodgy Dossier... If those had not been proven true than we'd still be debating them in the theoretical realm. How can I clarify my first sentence? My hypothesis is: They did go to the moon, probably long before the 60's, using advanced energy and propulsion systems designed by scientists like Viktor Schauberger and Nikoa Tesla, and also back-enginerered from salvaged alien vehicles, but they didn't tell anyone. When it was necessary in the psychological media programme for people to see men on the moon they fabricated a fictional version that showed people travelling to the moon using conventional technology.
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Post by randombloke on May 10, 2010 6:40:39 GMT -4
But sometimes Conspiracy Theories are reality. Do you want me to list Conspiracy Theories that later became fact: Watergate, MK Ultra, The Dodgy Dossier... If those had not been proven true than we'd still be debating them in the theoretical realm. And all of those, every single one, had evidence available from the start. In fact the evidence of the conspiracy was the reason for the conspiracy theory. Some muppet didn't wake up one day and say "I don't believe Nixon is an upstanding citizen at all! Therefore he must have swindled someone!" shortly followed by a dozen of his acquaintances coming up with an apparently plausible scenario or two each and proclaiming same from the rooftops whilst citing the Alpha Muppet's supposition as their only evidence. And, just for a laugh; each and every one of those conspiracies were whole orders of magnitude simpler than even the smallest possible Apollo hoax, yet they fell apart within a decade of each. That many people simply can't keep that big a secret no matter how much inducement can be brought to bear.
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Post by cos on May 10, 2010 6:41:21 GMT -4
My hypothesis is: They did go to the moon, probably long before the 60's, using advanced energy and propulsion systems designed by scientists like Viktor Schauberger and Nikoa Tesla, and also back-enginerered from salvaged alien vehicles, but they didn't tell anyone. When it was necessary in the psychological media programme for people to see men on the moon they fabricated a fictional version that showed people travelling to the moon using conventional technology. Hagbardceline, you have an vivid imagination and perhaps you should be writing science fantasy books. However, you have no evidence for any of your ideas and cannot refute the evidence for Apollo. This evidence cannot be dismissed out of hand if your proposition is to have any validity, although some might say that you are neatly sidestepping the issue by claiming it was real but done secretly before with different technology (of which there is no evidence). Comparing the moon hoax to Watergate, dodgy dosier (Iraq War) should give you a clue how actual relatively simple conspiracies come apart all too easily. This is a Science/engineering based forum. We are not startled by the sun coming up each morning. We know how the universe works and what is and isn't possible. We deal in demonstratable reality. It must be strange to live in a world where you understand so little that it all seems like magic. Evidence please. Anything that just isn't in your imagination?
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Post by Jason Thompson on May 10, 2010 7:04:15 GMT -4
This does seem to reproduce the presence of a vacuum, but faking this effect is possible. Really? With dust and huge mylar thermal blankets too? Please feel free to tell us how it was done. 'It was possible' is insufficient. Yes, and they deliberately fail to reproduce the sequence in order to get the desired result. They drop their feather vertically, shaft down, so it cuts through the air in its most aerodynamic configuration. Scott dropp the feather horizontally on Apollo 15, and had Bennett and Percy done that they would never have got it to hit the ground at the same time as the hammer. But then these are the same people who try to illustrate one of their shadow arguments by casting a shadow onto a vertical wall and watching its behaviour as they move closer to and farther from the light source. There is a distinct lack of vertical walls on the Moon....
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Post by Jason Thompson on May 10, 2010 7:06:46 GMT -4
I can't prove that it didn't happen. As you Skepmeisters love to say: you can't prove a negative. We're not asking you to prove a negative. If it didn't happen as advertised then it was faked somehow. What we ask for is proof of the faking. That is not proving a negative, because you would be proving that faking did happen. And we are dealing in evidence. There is a VAST pile of evidence for Apollo being genuine. It is not an abstract possibility, it is a documented sequence of events. If those events did not happen then the documentation is fake, so instead of trying to twist our argument into us trying to get you to prove something didn't happen, concentrate your efforts on proving that faking it did happen.
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Post by Jason Thompson on May 10, 2010 7:10:03 GMT -4
Have I ever seen evidence from them? Like government documents? Blueprints of Schauberger and Tesla-powered craft; no. But I've never seen an Apollo LM on the moon either. But there ARE government documents, blueprints and so on for the Apollo LM and its presence on the Moon. Why is it that all that evidence is faked but something for which you freely admit there is NO evidence is a more likely scenraio?
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Post by trebor on May 10, 2010 7:19:19 GMT -4
...but faking this effect is possible. How exactly? And the same goes for the scene where the astronaut drops a hammer and feather. In fact Bennett and Percy do their own fake to demonstrate in their film. That example you use is very interesting, firstly it should be noted that Percy dropped the feather point first. Nor did he use the same type of feather. Also the lab coated demonstrator carefully did not move his arms. In the original feather drop the arms of the astronaut move stupidly fast if sped up. Same for the lunar soil kicked about by the astronauts in the 'pendulum' video. If sped up it moves absurdly fast.
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Post by HeadLikeARock (was postbaguk) on May 10, 2010 8:02:50 GMT -4
How can I clarify my first sentence? My hypothesis is: They did go to the moon, probably long before the 60's, using advanced energy and propulsion systems designed by scientists like Viktor Schauberger and Nikoa Tesla, and also back-enginerered from salvaged alien vehicles, but they didn't tell anyone. When it was necessary in the psychological media programme for people to see men on the moon they fabricated a fictional version that showed people travelling to the moon using conventional technology. What you're describing isn't really a conspiracy theory, it's a fantasy. A very exciting sounding one, admittedly. If it were a Hollywood film I'd watch it. It doesn't do anything to challenge accepted reality. I made up a "conspiracy theory" once that England didn't win the World Cup in 1966. I found more evidence supporting that fantasy than you have yours. Similarly, I remember "proving" that Egypt, Canada and Ireland do not exist, and provided loads of evidence to support that fantasy. educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=10113&start=0&p=107658entry107658Indulging in a fantasy for a bit of fun is one thing, but using fantasy and a fertile imagination to re-write history is another. If you have any evidence to support your hypothesis, let's see it. If you don't have any evidence, that's fine, but don't expect anyone to take your claims with anything other than a hefty pinch of salt.
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Bob B.
Bob the Excel Guru?
Posts: 3,072
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Post by Bob B. on May 10, 2010 8:20:00 GMT -4
... sent 12 men to the moon in chemical rockets You keep saying that like there's something wrong with using chemical rockets. What specific issue do you have with chemical propulsion?
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Post by echnaton on May 10, 2010 11:18:55 GMT -4
But sometimes Conspiracy Theories are reality. But the reality of a conspiracy elsewhere says nothing about the presence of a moon hoax conspiracy. The moon hoax conspiracy is what we discuss in this board and what you have have no evidence for. We are not asking you to prove a negative, but to support some alternative idea that explains the evidence available about the moon missions. It is pretty simple. Just state what you think happened and why you think it to be true. Is that really too much to ask?
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Post by gwiz on May 10, 2010 12:48:20 GMT -4
Yes, and they deliberately fail to reproduce the sequence in order to get the desired result. They drop their feather vertically, shaft down, so it cuts through the air in its most aerodynamic configuration. Scott dropp the feather horizontally on Apollo 15, and had Bennett and Percy done that they would never have got it to hit the ground at the same time as the hammer. If you look at the Bennett/Percy film closely, you'll see that even with those alterations, they still fail: the hammer hits the ground first.
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Post by thetart on May 10, 2010 13:31:21 GMT -4
Yes, and they deliberately fail to reproduce the sequence in order to get the desired result. They drop their feather vertically, shaft down, so it cuts through the air in its most aerodynamic configuration. Scott dropp the feather horizontally on Apollo 15, and had Bennett and Percy done that they would never have got it to hit the ground at the same time as the hammer. If you look at the Bennett/Percy film closely, you'll see that even with those alterations, they still fail: the hammer hits the ground first. epic fail Hagbard. Try the "fluttering flag" one. Or how about the "blast crater"? Maybe the "C-rock"? Or perhaps the "why are there no stars" one? Bart Sibrel will be proud of you.
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