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Post by PhantomWolf on Jul 2, 2007 17:20:37 GMT -4
There are no clear shots of an object being thrown in all of the Apollo footage. I was referring to "Clear frontal shots" that show a good view of the speed and trajectory. The one above was taken at a distance.
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Post by nomuse on Jul 2, 2007 17:27:19 GMT -4
Save that pic. I suspect we'll be needing it in the future!
So what is it about a string that changes the flight characteristics of a rock? This I still don't get.
Unless he means as a launch assistance. Pity there's no evidence of use of a sling, bola, atlatl, or cricket bat in the videos!
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reynoldbot
Jupiter
A paper-white mask of evil.
Posts: 790
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Post by reynoldbot on Jul 2, 2007 17:38:53 GMT -4
oh crap, I missed the beginning of "rampant speculation showcase theatre" again!
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Post by JayUtah on Jul 2, 2007 17:40:58 GMT -4
oh crap, I missed the beginning of "rampant speculation showcase theatre" again!
That's okay; all the episodes have the same beginning .... middle, and, um, end.
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Post by Grand Lunar on Jul 2, 2007 17:45:25 GMT -4
ROTF & LOL, PhantomWolf! That was classic!
Indeed, I must ask, Rocky: how the heck does tying a cord to a cloth object make it appear that it's in a vaccum?
I know this is one you can definintely do at home. Tie a cord to a pillow sheet, ceran wrap (not made into a ball, which is how David Percy would do it), or anything that flutters in the wind. Then toss it, and see if it resembles the videos.
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reynoldbot
Jupiter
A paper-white mask of evil.
Posts: 790
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Post by reynoldbot on Jul 2, 2007 17:52:28 GMT -4
Wow, you actually took that ridiculous idea seriously. So, let's take a look at this:
The moon landings had to be filmed and presented live, as there are multiple examples of astronauts discussing current events such as scores to ongoing sports games and other various news items. Therefore, for the film to have been sped up and slowed down accurately, the astronauts had to memorize and perfectly perform many hours of choreography in one single take. No unpredictable events actually occured over hundreds of hours of filming that would have tipped off that the framerate was being sped up or slowed down, and the various unpredictable events that did occur were also choreographed, including many incidents of "accidental" dropping of sample bags, throwing hammers, falls, etc. This all went off without a hitch over several missions, and there is not a single second of footage where the transition from sped up footage to slowed down footage can be detected. Again, all this was done live.
Rocky, you still haven't answered the question I have asked you numerous times. How do you suppose the actors went about running and jumping at top speed for many hours at a time with no breaks wearing heavy spacesuits in earth gravity? You still haven't considered whether that is physically possible.
I and others have noticed lots of "probably" and "looks like"s in your arguments. Howabout some proof?
Prove it. Prove all of it. Prove some of it. Prove any of it. Prove even a single shred of any of the claims you've made. Prove something or go away. Just do something more than speculate. No more probablys or looks likes please.
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furi
Mars
The Secret is to keep banging those rocks together.
Posts: 260
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Post by furi on Jul 2, 2007 18:00:20 GMT -4
IMHO I think and I believe, it is obvious to anyone with half an acid that it looks like I could probably like this, possibly, but it s up to you Rocky to prove it.
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Post by nomuse on Jul 2, 2007 18:20:57 GMT -4
I've been struck while following DVD commentaries and reading up how little the blue-screen and other compositor tricks were used in films around the time of 2001. James Cameron comments he didn't get into it until Titanic; Aliens, Terminator (and of course 2001 itself). Lots of rear projection...and I remember 2001 made good use of front mirror tricks. Of course they did have something resembling multi-pass, and then of course the Dyxtraflex came along for Star Wars....
But basically a lot of the compositing, the "blue screen this and add a little dust to cover the seam" attitude is very modern -- and comes with modern tools.
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Post by PhantomWolf on Jul 2, 2007 18:28:24 GMT -4
It's interesting watching the information about the making of Lord of the Rings. While they did use a certain amount of blue screen for some scenes, a lot of it was done with just trick camera work, scale actors, models and matte painting.
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reynoldbot
Jupiter
A paper-white mask of evil.
Posts: 790
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Post by reynoldbot on Jul 2, 2007 18:28:55 GMT -4
121:25John goes to the north side of the Central Station and, once there, uses the UHT to flip a cloth cover out of the way to the north. We get to see the entire flight.Clip 2 1.08mb That one is superb. I hadn't seen it yet. Notice the flimsiness of the cloth cover when he jabs it with the UHT. It's very clearly made of lightweight material, yet shows no evidence whatsoever of interacting with air. No billowing of the material, and no sign of a slow, fluttering descent to the surface. Great stuff. If any HB can duplicate this video in a regular 1g, oxygen/nitrogen environment, I'll convert. I wholeheartedly agree. I submit this video as full proof that the astronauts really went to the moon. You could possibly somehow attach a wire to the cloth to pull it up (how to do it so the cloth looks the way it does, freely rotating with no evidence of pull points I have no clue), but there is no way you could bring the cloth back down like that. You could probably measure the deceleration of ascent to the acceleration of descent in that video to a perfect parabolic curve. Phenomenal.
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Post by PhantomWolf on Jul 2, 2007 18:31:16 GMT -4
Don't worry, I predict that Rocky will totally ignore it, or claim that the link doesn't work for him so he can't watch it, or failing both of those, suggest that they had a special black ops alien cloth that has magical properties that allows it to react that way.
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Post by BertL on Jul 2, 2007 18:36:28 GMT -4
It's interesting watching the information about the making of Lord of the Rings. While they did use a certain amount of blue screen for some scenes, a lot of it was done with just trick camera work, scale actors, models and matte painting. I must have watched that chapter on forced perspective and stuff like that hundreds of times. Too bad it's so hard to do with LEGO, because of the studs and all. It's really interesting though.
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Post by captain swoop on Jul 2, 2007 18:42:31 GMT -4
Why do you all bother? When someone thinks that the hatch was too small for people to use when there is film of them using it, what hope have you?
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Post by svector on Jul 2, 2007 18:42:40 GMT -4
I told you how it could be done--sift it and then wash it as many times as necessary until there is no dust. You say that just pouring it will cause enough erosion to create enough dust-sized particles to form clouds. If that's really the case (which I doubt), it can be transported and put in place carefully. You said somewhere that there are footprints in the footage that show obvious dust-sized particles; maybe they only put the sifted washed sand where the rover was going to drive. You have never addressed the * why* of this scenario. Why would NASA expend so much effort, in the middle of an already infinitely complex deception, to reproduce a material that no one knew the exact properties of anyway? Faced with a million technical issues needing resolution to produce something close to a believable hoax, why would they willingly choose to pile on more complexity by insisting that the faux regolith be a material prone to aerosolization? Surely an agency capable of pulling off the biggest hoax the world has ever known, would not be so inept as to consciously burden the project with unnecessary obstacles. No one knew lunar regolith was supposed to retain precise imprints, so NASA (with their unlimited budget) could have just as easily used some coarse-grained composite material which didn't create lingering dust. " Screw the footprints, let's keep the set dust-free", would've been the logical plan of attack. Would you care to address this contradiction rocky? [prediction: he doesn't care to]
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furi
Mars
The Secret is to keep banging those rocks together.
Posts: 260
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Post by furi on Jul 2, 2007 18:44:21 GMT -4
It's interesting watching the information about the making of Lord of the Rings. While they did use a certain amount of blue screen for some scenes, a lot of it was done with just trick camera work, scale actors, models and matte painting. I must have watched that chapter on forced perspective and stuff like that hundreds of times. Too bad it's so hard to do with LEGO, because of the studs and all. It's really interesting though. I suppose you could stick sticklebrick studs on the top of the distant bricks. or 1*1 cylinder on scaled up Brickstuds for superclose foreground, and have things happening the middle dist. (although you would need to scale the bricks up by 8.) maybe they washed the cloth?
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