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Post by lionking on Jan 11, 2011 13:32:31 GMT -4
The problem with this idea is that when a government imposes rules which suit the majority population, or the dominant population, the remainder have no loyalty to their country. This appears to have been very much the case with Sudan.
How comfortable would you feel living in Lebanon if all positions in government were occupied by Muslims, and they imposed Sharia Law on the entire population, Muslim or not?
yes I agree that they will not feel loyal to their country and will feel marginalized, and sometimes the hange is very difficult if one wants to change the regime to be fair. I , for one, thaught about separation after the July war. But then, policy has proved conclusively that it is not stable andchanges come about every now and then, so it is not worth it to loose our country. We can work for change and beleive in it. Sadly, it all depends on regional policies and the help of the outside countries who have their interests. Here they proved that they are all tools for the outside countries, but the people still want change and hope for it rather than think about separation. They think of it like that; you have a brother who is handicapped and doesn't understand anything and is a burden, but you have to live with him no matter what. They put behind the separationist ideas because they are impossible. Of course there is always the fear that outside countries might have the interests again to split he country. They will surely promise their tools interests. So this answers the question that there are no serious splits without powers, and these powers of money and weapons are given from the powerful.
So the problems are there and people might want separation [here it became a taboo] , but unless they get help they will not do it and will try the 'right way' of trying to change thier country without loosing it. I can't , for example, imagine that I will only live in the Shouf and be forbidden to visit the North, Bekaa and South without a passport. I have stuck in mind that Baalbak's temple is one of the symbols of Lebanon same as the Cedars. I don't want to loose these if Hizbollah or or other parties are wackos.
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Post by rmaxwell on Jan 30, 2011 0:22:14 GMT -4
I would look up the definitions of "affect" if I were you. I didn't get it When randombloke writes "President Obama affects to be happy about any sweeping democratically induced change" he means that Obama is only pretending. In this case, it seems he is supposed to be genuinely happy, but for a different reason. |
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Post by lionking on Jan 31, 2011 3:25:09 GMT -4
what is happening in this world? after Tunisia came Algeria and now the very serious situation in WEgypt. America seems to stand by the rioters. We all know thta they don't car for democracy but for their interests, so is it a plan to topple Mubarak? do they want to bring the islamic fundamentalsits so t oescalate the situation in the ME? hence the new ME that Condolissa Rice spoke about? since when America was against Husni Mubarak? as to the Tunsiian Zein Al Abideen Bin Ali, the west refued to even receive him..
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Post by PeterB on Jan 31, 2011 8:41:44 GMT -4
What's being reported in Australia is that the USA is trying to stay neutral, not that it's supporting the rioters. I think the US Government is well aware that a democratically elected government is likely to be strongly anti-US, yet they're also aware that Mubarak can only stop the riots with excessive violence. The suggestion is that they're trying to convince Mubarak to stand aside and nominate a successor who's sort-of acceptable to everyone.
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Jason
Pluto
May all your hits be crits
Posts: 5,579
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Post by Jason on Jan 31, 2011 12:30:51 GMT -4
If Egypt's people wants Mubarak gone then we have to advise him to bow to the will of the people. One of our founding principles is that governments should only govern with the consent of the people.
Mubarak has been urged both privately and publicly to open up his government to other parties and engage in other democractic reforms by a long line of US administrations. He didn't listen.
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Post by echnaton on Feb 1, 2011 14:01:24 GMT -4
The best course of action for the US is to remain neutral. Long term stability is not gained by supporting faltering dictators (been there done that) so there is little to be gained for anyone by throwing our weight behind Mubarak. He is on his way out and good riddance. Better to work with his replacement and not give the fundies even more fuel for their fire.
It is increasingly difficult to govern by force these days and the Egyptian Army has been very wise in the restraint (such as it is) applied in this revolt. The police have apparently been more brutal. I doubt any of this will result in free elections or a true democracy but a little transparency, a plan for sharing the power of government and a peaceful means of selecting new leaders would be a big improvement.
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Post by lionking on Feb 1, 2011 15:49:21 GMT -4
Iran is also happy about this. they said it makes a ME ruled by Islamic states easier.
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Post by lionking on Feb 1, 2011 15:49:40 GMT -4
by the way Syria will have its share of riots on Friday. We are interested here to see how the regime will act.
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Post by PeterB on Feb 5, 2011 10:06:02 GMT -4
Iran is also happy about this. they said it makes a ME ruled by Islamic states easier. And I'm sure Hamas will be happy too - almost any government in Egypt is likely to end the blockade of Gaza. Now that's something you want to see too, isn't it? |
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Post by lionking on Feb 5, 2011 14:57:54 GMT -4
Iran is also happy about this. they said it makes a ME ruled by Islamic states easier. And I'm sure Hamas will be happy too - almost any government in Egypt is likely to end the blockade of Gaza. Now that's something you want to see too, isn't it? of course you are kidding. we lost an ally, no matter what the mistakes he has, but it doesn't suit me that a government that is with iran rules and suffocates us |
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Post by suele on Apr 23, 2011 16:33:40 GMT -4
They should have agreed on a solution They did  I wouldn't worry too much. There will be two countries where there used to be one. This has happened around the world many times. Sometimes the divorce is chaotic and bloody (like the disintegration of Yugoslavia), but in this case, things were chaotic and bloody before the divorce. If this solves the problem that causes people there to want to fight each other, would that be a bad thing? Why should other Arab countries fear such a split? The problem for many African countries is that their borders were drawn up by European colonial powers with no regard for the cultural and tribal differences. Sudan is one such case. I can see why the rulers of those countries would be worried. The Kurdish case is the obvious example. One might think it is a good idea, but the people currently running the affected countries mostly do not. So I can get why they might not be real thrilled about having a precedent for partition based on ethnicity. Some of the Arab and other regional boundaries are quite arbitrary too, some were drawn by the European powers from the corpse of a dead empire. Parts of what are now Iraq would have been in Turkey instead if the founders of modern Turkey had managed to pull it off. Jordan is a contender for the title of most artificial country in that part of the world. I suppose if I were the rather well-placed president/king/whatever of one of these countries, any hint of instability or change might interfere with a pleasant night's sleep. Two long-entrenched northern African rulers deposed (and possibly in the scrubs), another struggling to keep his job, protests/riots in several other countries, still another country in the area partitioning along ethnic lines - I can understand how some of the regional rulers might be a bit worried right now. |
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Post by suele on Apr 24, 2011 4:07:50 GMT -4
And another one bites the dust! Sounds like the president of Yemen will be stepping down. The agreement includes immunity, but I think it might be wise to err on the side of caution, and get out of town any way - such immunity deals have been revoked.
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Post by lionking on Apr 26, 2011 3:23:32 GMT -4
And I'm sure Hamas will be happy too - almost any government in Egypt is likely to end the blockade of Gaza. Now that's something you want to see too, isn't it? of course you are kidding. we lost an ally, no matter what the mistakes he has, but it doesn't suit me that a government that is with iran rules and suffocates us Until now, no signs of any fundamental Islmaic state shows in Egypt, and no sign of a government supporting Iran comes along..it si good if things continue like this ..it was then a healthy revolution that hopefully brings a good state to Egypt..Now the problem is Syria..Assad is attackign them saying that there are Islamic fundamentalists (same as wha tGaddafi says)..I hope any regime that comes to Syria rules fairly and nor fanatically... I was told that they started with a religious tone but then changed.. We hope they cut the weapons flow to Hizbollah (the new regime if it came) and give Lebanon peace, but we surely don't want any islamic fundamentalist regime next to us and it is against the minorities in Syria and against its prosperity.. but I don't think they can achieve anything..Bashar is acting liek Gaddafi and this will go no where.. I hope I am mistaken |
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Post by twik on Apr 27, 2011 10:56:48 GMT -4
what is happening in this world? after Tunisia came Algeria and now the very serious situation in WEgypt. America seems to stand by the rioters. We all know thta they don't car for democracy but for their interests, so is it a plan to topple Mubarak? do they want to bring the islamic fundamentalsits so t oescalate the situation in the ME? hence the new ME that Condolissa Rice spoke about? since when America was against Husni Mubarak? as to the Tunsiian Zein Al Abideen Bin Ali, the west refued to even receive him.. Honestly, you have to stop seeing all world events through "America is the evil puppetmaster" eyes. Perhaps people in the middle east are making their own decisions. I know that is scary - if things go wrong, it's their own fault. But if you can't own up to that, you will never truly run your own life. |
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Post by lionking on Apr 28, 2011 2:31:40 GMT -4
We'll have to wait and see what these revolutions will get to.. but what I said that countries follow their interests is plain and simple..and everybody understands it. At first, it was very awkwar to see America stand against their allies, namely Mubarak and Bin Ali.. this would dricve someone to ask why would they do that especially that they don't care for democracy and things like this and they would be afraid if regimes anti-israel would come.. I am not saying this is the absolute truth but YOU should stop criticizing people when they analyze situations accorign to what they see
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