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Post by PhantomWolf on Jul 3, 2006 18:50:49 GMT -4
On the radio I am listening to a guy from the US who is introducing Transcendental Meditation inrto Schools in the US. He states that this is a science not a religion, but I was always of the understanding that it was a westernization of Hinduism. What do other's think? Does anyone actually know more about it?
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Post by Apollo Gnomon on Jul 3, 2006 21:39:44 GMT -4
That's my understanding of the cultural structure of it - Hinduism as interpreted by New Age Californians.
The meditation itself is like any other meditation - you sit and get into your head. Unlike zen meditation or right-brain drawing, TM invokes a trancey half-asleepish high-alpha wave activity mode. Or so I gather.
I don't think any part of it qualifies as science as I would define it.
The TM people bought a discredited college campus in some small town in Ohio, I dunno, mid '80s or something. The townspeople were excited that a bunch of goofy Californians were going to restart the campus, but then the students show up and they don't drink or anything, so that was apparently a bit of a disappointment, but the students are well behaved so in the end the town is all right with it.
I also gather this town had all the alternative religions run through it over the years, especially the Urantia movement. I can't remember the name of the town, but I'll ask my wife. She used to work with someone from there who talked about how quietly weird the place was.
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Post by Dead Hoosiers on Jul 4, 2006 18:47:51 GMT -4
Maharishi Mahesh Yogi at first introduced TM to the West as a Hindu religious practice. He openly taught that its purpose was to produce "a legendary substance called 'soma' in the meditator's body so the gods of the Hindu pantheon could be fed and awakened." But when TM was excluded from public schools and government funding as a religious practice, Maharishi quickly deleted all reference to religion and began presenting TM as pure science.
In 1957 they [Maharishi] started an organization called Spiritual Regeneration Movement . . . for religious and educational purposes only . . .
In 1974 [he] . . . completely renamed all the corporations . . . [under] a new set of Articles of Incorporation, deleting everything that said "spiritual" and "religious" . . . to legitimize the teaching of Hinduism.
For example, Maharishi . . . began calling God "the vacuum state." He instrucred [TMers] in the deception.
. . . Maharishi told those on the inside: "It doesn't matter if you lie teaching people . . . [because] TM is the ultimate, absolute spiritual authority on the face of this Earth. [TMers] are the only teachers and upholders of genuine spiritual tradition. . . . They're running the universe. They are controlling the gods through the soma sacrifice.
Quoted from Occult Invasion by Dave Hunt
It doesn't surprise me that it's now being taught in our schools. Our poor kids are being subjected to every sort of perversion and parents are becoming increasingly unable to stop it.
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Post by Apollo Gnomon on Jul 4, 2006 19:32:54 GMT -4
Nonsense, yes, but perversion?
I'm having a hard time cogitating an intelligent response to this. Are you THAT threatened by different idea systems? I've read some of Hunt -- do you agree with his notion of "occult?"
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Post by Apollo Gnomon on Jul 4, 2006 19:34:17 GMT -4
The Maharishi college is in Fairfield, Iowa, by the way, not in Ohio.
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Post by Dead Hoosiers on Jul 5, 2006 1:45:44 GMT -4
AG: I'm having a hard time cogitating an intelligent response to this.
So I see.
Are you THAT threatened by different idea systems?
Not as threatened as you appear to be by my beliefs. Why do I have to feel threatened? Can't I just disagree?
do you agree with his notion of "occult?"
Yes, I do.
You may not be aware of some of the things to which our educational system is exposing our children. You might take note that I didn't say TM is a perversion.
I provided PhantomWolf some information he may be interested in. What's your beef?
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lenbrazil
Saturn
Now there's a man with an open mind - you can feel the breeze from here!
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Post by lenbrazil on Jul 5, 2006 9:15:20 GMT -4
Maharishi Mahesh Yogi at first introduced TM to the West as a Hindu religious practice. He openly taught that its purpose was to produce "a legendary substance called 'soma' in the meditator's body so the gods of the Hindu pantheon could be fed and awakened." But when TM was excluded from public schools and government funding as a religious practice, Maharishi quickly deleted all reference to religion and began presenting TM as pure science.In 1957 they [Maharishi] started an organization called Spiritual Regeneration Movement . . . for religious and educational purposes only . . .
In 1974 [he] . . . completely renamed all the corporations . . . [under] a new set of Articles of Incorporation, deleting everything that said "spiritual" and "religious" . . . to legitimize the teaching of Hinduism.
For example, Maharishi . . . began calling God "the vacuum state." He instrucred [TMers] in the deception.
. . . Maharishi told those on the inside: "It doesn't matter if you lie teaching people . . . [because] TM is the ultimate, absolute spiritual authority on the face of this Earth. [TMers] are the only teachers and upholders of genuine spiritual tradition. . . . They're running the universe. They are controlling the gods through the soma sacrifice.Quoted from Occult Invasion by Dave Hunt It doesn't surprise me that it's now being taught in our schools. Our poor kids are being subjected to every sort of perversion and parents are becoming increasingly unable to stop it. DH you seem to have reading comprehension problems. It was stated that TM was being taught at a private college not in public schools
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lenbrazil
Saturn
Now there's a man with an open mind - you can feel the breeze from here!
Posts: 1,045
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Post by lenbrazil on Jul 5, 2006 9:21:19 GMT -4
Are you THAT threatened by different idea systems?Not as threatened as you appear to be by my beliefs. Why do I have to feel threatened? Can't I just disagree? [...]. You may not be aware of some of the things to which our educational system is exposing our children. You might take note that I didn't say TM is a perversion. But you equated it with perversion, perversion that parents are powerless to prevent they kids from being exposed to at school. That sounds kind of threatening to me. AG came across as less threatened by you as you are by TM.
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Post by Apollo Gnomon on Jul 5, 2006 11:50:32 GMT -4
I feel quite threatened by people claiming their unique belief system is the only way to believe. Last time I checked nobody has been able to "prove" the correctness of ANY religion. Perhaps Shinto is the "one right thing." How do you know?
DH has stated on more than one occasion that she feels the Catholic church is not "christian" as she defines it. To borrow a concept from another thread she's in, either the oldest church is closest to the source and closest to the truth or the newest revelation has supersceded all previous revelations.
Or perhaps they're all irrelevant. But that's a topic for the other thread.
Trancendental Meditation doesn't bother me, personally. If people find it comforting, at least they're not doing drugs. The Ayurvedic dietary/medical theories are pretty odd but they seem fairly harmless.
On the other hand, the Natural Law Party, an offshoot of TM with some official backing, DOES bother me. When religion gets political it tries to change the rules for everybody.
I also dislike the Republican/"christian" connection in this country. The whole country has been given the "choice" between a couple of baskets of ideas, and if your ideas do not fit neatly into one basket or another, your political needs are not going to be met by any one party. The Greens, for example, care about the health of the planet, but they are stridently against genetically modified organisms (GMO's) in all shapes and forms. But if we're going to continue allowing the citizens of free nations the unfettered right to breed indiscriminately we're going to need all the population-support tools we can find.
But that's politics, so let's not talk about it in public.
One thing I've heard about TM is the idea that if enough people meditate at the same time actual change can be made in the world. I guess that's the same as group prayer. My grampa told me to pray into one hand and spit in the other and see which one fills up faster.
TM has no place being taught in public schools. I agree firmly with DH on this point.
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Jason
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Post by Jason on Jul 5, 2006 11:59:27 GMT -4
I'm afraid I don't really know anything about the current topic, Transcendental Meditation, so I won't pontificate on the subject, but the idea of coming up with criteria for determining what is a religion and what isn't is interesting to me.
What do you think are acceptable criteria for defining a philosophy or set of beliefs as a religion?
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Post by lionking on Jul 5, 2006 15:24:02 GMT -4
I think christians don't like the TM thing, as I recieved my studies at a christian school . once, the teacher brough an interview that was on a newspaper or magazine . it spoke to a man who said he discovered it was all satanic. he said his friend has gone half mad, breaking things when she can't do it anymore. he said that the student of TM is supposed to repeat a word that is of Hindu gods, one of them is INKA, the god of blood. he also said that it is the satanic powers that make these people lift above the ground. The truth is that I don't know what is the truth. However, I should say that I believe meditation to be in the creation of God, and how things that don't have brains act as if they do. In Lebanon also, a Hindu master told someone who I know (but not a close friend) that three quarter of what is being done is not a true TM. He said that they laugh at ppl and take money and know nothing about that. The teacher said he is ready to teach anyone for free. Again, I don't know the truth behind that. regards
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Post by Dead Hoosiers on Jul 5, 2006 15:28:41 GMT -4
lenbrazil: DH you seem to have reading comprehension problems. It was stated that TM was being taught at a private college not in public schools
Well, one of us does at any rate. I was responding the original post where PW stated "...On the radio I am listening to a guy from the US who is introducing Transcendental Meditation inrto Schools in the US."
OK?
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Jason
Pluto
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Post by Jason on Jul 5, 2006 15:42:34 GMT -4
I guess we need to ask PhantomWolf if the report he heard concerned introducing it into public schools or private schools/colleges.
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Post by PhantomWolf on Jul 5, 2006 16:30:24 GMT -4
According to the speaker, who I believe was the headmaster of the Maharishi College, they are introducing it into PUBLIC schools in the US and are wanting to do the same here. My worry here is two fold. A) I knew someone that had been involved in it and he told me that it was undercover Hinduism, and B) The headmaster actually stated that while they didn't actually teach yogi flying, that the students often become interested and wanted to know more. This second thing was really what triggered alarm bells for me as to my understanding yogi flying is a total scam and part of a religion. If by teaching TM, they are drawing kids into that Religion then it's religion by stealth. Now when there is a huge outcry (even over here were we don't have a legal separation of Church and State) over simple non-demoninational/religion prayer in shools, introducing TM seems to me to be a rather hypocritical thing to be doing, or is it just any form of Christianity that is being banned from schools?
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Post by Dead Hoosiers on Jul 5, 2006 17:15:24 GMT -4
It sounds like that's what they may be doing (introducting Hinduism under the guise of science). It's underhanded and unlawful.
I'm also concerned about the dangers of TM. I've read a bit about TM practitioners who become violent, have hallucinations, and commit suicide, among other unpleasant things.
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