Jason
Pluto
May all your hits be crits
Posts: 5,579
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Post by Jason on Aug 22, 2007 11:36:51 GMT -4
Very true. For example, some people persistently spell the name of one of the books wrong. Let me guess. Job?
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Post by gillianren on Aug 22, 2007 13:21:35 GMT -4
My Bible, at least, spells "Matthew" with two t's.
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Jason
Pluto
May all your hits be crits
Posts: 5,579
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Post by Jason on Aug 22, 2007 13:23:59 GMT -4
Ah, you were sniping at me. I thought you might be. But didn't you say persistently? I think I only mis-spelled it once on this thread.
My next guess was going to be "Ecclesiastes".
EDIT: Okay, you got me - I did it twice. It still seems like a rather petty nitpick. You must still be sour about losing the argument on the "homosexual" thread.
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Post by LunarOrbit on Aug 22, 2007 14:33:14 GMT -4
You must still be sour about losing the argument on the "homosexual" thread. Not to take this off topic, but the poll still shows 81.5% support for gay marriage... I wouldn't be declaring victory if I were you (you must be using the same kind of backwards poll logic that President Bush lives by ).
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Jason
Pluto
May all your hits be crits
Posts: 5,579
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Post by Jason on Aug 22, 2007 14:50:20 GMT -4
I declare victory when my opponent quits the field without addressing my arguments.
The poll numbers don't overly concern me because they're what I expected (although I actually expected it would be more than 80%). Internet polls are fairly useless except as conversation starters. It's pretty easy to click an answer on a poll and then never look at the thread again. The real debate that followed didn't involve most of those who voted.
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Post by LunarOrbit on Aug 22, 2007 16:03:28 GMT -4
So to win a debate you just need to be more stubborn than your opponent?
I suspect the reason Gillianren hasn't posted in that thread lately has more to do with her willingness to walk away from a futile discussion (if for no other reason than to lower her blood pressure) than it does with your ability to convince anyone that you're right.
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Post by gillianren on Aug 22, 2007 16:23:33 GMT -4
Actually, I thought I gave a pretty clear reason for departing the field. The medication I'm on makes any sustained thinking on any sustained subject problematic, as I said. I am constantly tired, even when I am feeling restless. I don't consider you to have won, Jason. Frankly, I consider you to have retreated into the prejudices that have been instilled in you since childhood and that you've never really put thought of your own on the subject. I think you're wrong, I think you're ignorant, and I think you're thoughtless of the lives of others. But your ignoring my post explaining why I can't participate in prolonged debate at the moment is just one more example of it.
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Jason
Pluto
May all your hits be crits
Posts: 5,579
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Post by Jason on Aug 22, 2007 16:34:27 GMT -4
So to win a debate you just need to be more stubborn than your opponent? If you want to give up on an argument that isn't going anywhere there are ways to do so (see the Mormonism thread). If you quit abruptly without addressing your opponent's last points at all then yes, you've lost. You are probably correct that it was because she was getting frustrated. But as I say, cutting off debate abrubtly leaves the audeince in the dark as to whether you left because you were unable to refute your opponent's arguments or for some other reason. And what do internet debates have to do with convincing other people of anything anyway? How often do you think anyone is really convinced of something by an argument on the internet?
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Jason
Pluto
May all your hits be crits
Posts: 5,579
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Post by Jason on Aug 22, 2007 16:43:30 GMT -4
Actually, I thought I gave a pretty clear reason for departing the field. The medication I'm on makes any sustained thinking on any sustained subject problematic, as I said. I am constantly tired, even when I am feeling restless. I did read that post, and I sympathize, but it also seemed an easy way to end a debate you were obviously becoming rather emotional about. And are you planning on returning anytime soon? We left off with your claim that Dr. McHugh was speaking from a position of religious bias concerning the harmfulness of "gender re-assignment" surgery and it's banning at John Hopkins, and my request that you point to what you thought was evidence of that bias, other than the simple fact that he disagrees with you. And I believe your opinions were formed from your emotional associations with members of those lifestyles rather than by rational consideration of the evidence, and that you've accepted their statements at face value without putting much thought of your own into the subject. Well I think you're wrong too, but I don't think you're either willfully ignorant or callous. So I guess I have a higher opinion of you than you do of me.
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Post by Ginnie on Aug 22, 2007 19:04:23 GMT -4
And I believe your opinions were formed from your emotional associations with members of those lifestyles rather than by rational consideration of the evidence, and that you've accepted their statements at face value without putting much thought of your own into the subject. Sounds so clinical. Having 'emotional associations with members of those lifestyles' is called supporting relatives ones and friends with loove and understanding. Or you could call it 'life'.
Oh, what's the prize if you win?
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Post by gillianren on Aug 23, 2007 0:37:39 GMT -4
I thought one of the great virtues was compassion. Part of compassion is empathy--being able to understand what other people are experiencing. I'm glad you have a higher opinion of me than I do of you, but I'd gladly sacrifice it if you tried to understand what I, and indeed those friends of mine "in that lifestyle" (and what a fundamental misunderstanding that is!), are experiencing.
I've never been anything but open about my mental health problems. In this moment, they're worse than usual. I cannot help taking afternoon naps, no matter how much or how little sleep I get during the day. My depression has not been alleviated; there are days, albeit only a few, where I have not posted at all due to depression--or a panic attack. I had another one of those recently.
If you want to take my current problems as proof that I'm conceding your point, whatever. Still, those paying attention and being compassionate will understand.
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Jason
Pluto
May all your hits be crits
Posts: 5,579
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Post by Jason on Aug 23, 2007 11:05:06 GMT -4
Oh, what's the prize if you win? Nothing. Internet debates are really only for entertainment purposes anyway.
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Jason
Pluto
May all your hits be crits
Posts: 5,579
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Post by Jason on Aug 23, 2007 11:15:58 GMT -4
If you hadn't called me an ignorant, uneducated, calloused bigot so recently the "I'm the victim here" approach might have been more effective with me, Gillian.
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Jason
Pluto
May all your hits be crits
Posts: 5,579
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Post by Jason on Aug 23, 2007 11:25:27 GMT -4
Sounds so clinical. Having 'emotional associations with members of those lifestyles' is called supporting relatives ones and friends with loove and understanding. Or you could call it 'life'. Which is the best way to form your own opinions? For instance, if everyone you know beleived that Apollo was faked, or that 9/11 was the result of a conspiracy in the American government, would supporting your relatives and friends with love and understanding then require you to agree with them? Or should you instead look at evidence from outside your own social circle and form your own opinion, acknowledging your friends and family with understanding and love while refusing to agree with their flawed opinions?
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Post by Ginnie on Aug 23, 2007 15:10:46 GMT -4
Which is the best way to form your own opinions? For instance, if everyone you know beleived that Apollo was faked, or that 9/11 was the result of a conspiracy in the American government, would supporting your relatives and friends with love and understanding then require you to agree with them? Or should you instead look at evidence from outside your own social circle and form your own opinion, acknowledging your friends and family with understanding and love while refusing to agree with their flawed opinions? Oh never mind...
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