TR-201 Engine

[Bob B.]

This clavius page states,

The video frames at right show the ignition of a Boeing Delta-II second stage, powered by an Aerojet AJ10-118K engine burning Aerozine 50 and nitrogen tetroxide. The engine shown is virtually identical in size and operation to the TRW TR-201 engine used as the ascent stage motor on the Apollo lunar module.

This thread started me doing a little research, and every reference I've found has stated the TR-201 was derived from the LM's descent stage engine. The TR-201 was used in the Delta second stage starting with the 1000 series. The Delta 4000 series began using the Aerojet AJ10-118K.

[JayUtah]

You may be right. My source is this
www.astronautix.com/engines/tr201.htm
but as you can see, the numbers are more consistent with the descent engine than with the ascent engine. I'll keep looking.

[Bob B.]

Here are some of the pages I found claiming the TR-201 is derived from the LM descent stage:

kevinforsyth.net/delta/backgrnd.htm
www.tbs-satellite.com/tse/online/lanc_thor_delta.html
www.hobbyspace.com/AAdmin/archive/RLV/2003/RLVNews2003-03.html

As you say, it appears from the specifications the TR-201 is most likely the DPS engine.

[JayUtah]

That's sufficient. The page now reads, "...virtually identical in size and operation to the engine used as the descent stage motor on the Apollo lunar module."

Upon closer study, the TRW TR-201 never flew on the lunar module as either engine. It was derived from the descent engine. STL built the descent engine and TRW built the TR-201.

[gwiz]

jayutah said:

STL built the descent engine and TRW built the TR-201.

I believe STL was a division of TRW.

[JayUtah]

Actually STL became TRW. Now it's part of Northrup-Grumman. Aerospace geneology is worse than in Appalachia.

[gwiz]

bob said:

The TR-201 was used in the Delta second stage starting with the 1000 series. The Delta 4000 series began using the Aerojet AJ10-118K.

Not quite. The Delta 3x1x designation used the TR-201 and the 3x2x introduced the AJ10-118K.

Most of the Delta propulsion systems of this period were derived from the moon programme. The first stage RS-27 motor was based on the H-1 of the Saturn 1 and Saturn 1B, the two alternatives for the second stage were a modified LMDE (TR-201) and a scaled down SM engine (AJ10-118K) and the solid propellant motor of the third stage was developed from the Surveyor retro-rocket. Only the first stage thrust augmentation motors had no such heritage.

[Bob B.]

gwiz said:

Not quite. The Delta 3x1x designation used the TR-201 and the 3x2x introduced the AJ10-118K.

I stand corrected.

jayutah said:

Actually STL became TRW. Now it's part of Northrup-Grumman. Aerospace geneology is worse than in Appalachia.

This must be commonplace in industrial America because I see the same thing happening in my business. I sometimes have difficulty keeping track of which company is owned by which conglomerate; it seems to change every year. I think valve manufacturers may be the worst.

[JayUtah]

I know a guy at TRW who literally has a different conglomerate ownership logo on his shirt every time I see him. Rocketdyne used to be owned by Boeing, and now I think Pratt and Whitney own them. Or maybe the other way round. Thiokol became Morton-Thiokol and is now ATK/Thiokol, which also subsumed Hercules into ATK/Hercules.

I have a lot of affection for the old Rocketdyne H-1: It was the first rocket motor I ever disassembled and studied in depth. I even got most of the pieces put back right.

[LunarOrbit]

I thought pretty much everything was owned by Boeing now...

[echnaton]

jayutah said:

Rocketdyne used to be owned by Boeing, and now I think Pratt and Whitney own them. Or maybe the other way round.

United Technologies, parent company of Pratt and Whitney bought Rocketdyne from Boeing on August 2 of this year and will be folding it into Pratt’s Space Propulsion segment. As a sign of the times in the aerospace and defense business, the purchase gives UTC a near monopoly on U. S. rocket engines and all the customers just shrugged.

[sts60]

Rocketdyne used to be owned by Boeing, and now I think Pratt and Whitney own them.

Indeed they do. We are working with some Rocketdyne guys on RTG stuff.

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Doh! ToSeeked by echnaton!