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Post by Dead Hoosiers on Apr 29, 2009 23:30:22 GMT -4
WHO declared a Level 5 alert against the weaponized "swine" flu. I hope to God it's not the real thing, but we're in danger of martial law, forced vaccinations and quarantine in FEMA camps. I'm getting my information from infowars.com (Alex Jones). If you love your life, do NOT take any vaccine.
This is a friendly alert. Please check out this information before killing the messenger.
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Post by scooter on Apr 29, 2009 23:43:00 GMT -4
Last I heard, there IS no vaccine for this particular flu strain. Not too worried at this point... Concentration camps...oh, what a dandy way to avoid contagion...smash a bazillion folks together in one small area..."hoping" none of them have "it".
I'll pass on the Jones info, thank you.
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Post by Dead Hoosiers on Apr 29, 2009 23:58:46 GMT -4
Right. There's no real vaccine. Word is that the old H5N1 (avian flu) vaccine will be given--this is the vaccine Baxter got caught contaminating with live viruses.
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Post by laurel on Apr 30, 2009 1:56:52 GMT -4
If someone wanted to weaponize a virus, wouldn't they be better off using something more lethal like smallpox or the Ebola virus? Here in Canada, most of the people with swine flu (19 as of today) have very mild cases and haven't required hospitalization. It doesn't like sound like a very effective weapon.
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Post by ineluki on Apr 30, 2009 5:04:23 GMT -4
This is a friendly alert. Please check out this information before killing the messenger. Done, consider yourself killed... Jones couldn't predict the wheather for 10:01 AM if he was looking up to the sky at 10:00 AM..
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Post by tedward on Apr 30, 2009 5:14:49 GMT -4
What qualifications does Mr Jones have? Apart from liking the sound of his own voice?
I understand that a vaccine will be around shortly after taking cultures from the infected now. But, as it has hit in spring/summer its next winter they are worried about and it may well change more by then so what is made soon could have no effect in the winter so a close eye will be kept on it. Not from Mr Jones site, from an informed medical person with actual qualifications. Of course, he may be wrong or I have wax in my ears and mis heard him.
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Post by PeterB on Apr 30, 2009 5:44:35 GMT -4
WHO declared a Level 5 alert against the weaponized 'swine' flu. On what basis do you use the term "weaponised"? Just out of interest, why don't you tell us how many people died in each of the last ten years from non-weaponised flu? I don't think anyone really knows at the moment. But WHO certainly sounds a bit concerned. Why put lots of people together in camps? Why not instead enforce quarantine - forcing people to stay in their own homes would be a far more effective way of slowing the spread of the disease. Well, I've already booked my flu vaccination for next Thursday. Work provides these for free each April-May, obviously because they consider the cost of providing vaccines to staff cheaper than the cost of having lots of people off work on sick leave. How can it be a friendly alert when you use terms like "weaponised", "martial law", "forced vaccinations" and "FEMA camps"? You come across like someone running into a cinema yelling "Fire!" because you saw someone light a cigarette across the road. Anyway, here in Oz we have the far less threatening words from the Prime Minister: "Make sure you wash your hands regularly," or words to that effect. Advice that's cheap, sensible and effective.
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Post by PhantomWolf on Apr 30, 2009 7:12:27 GMT -4
Anyone that listens to Alex Jones deserves everything they get.
The swine flku is not weaponized, it is a naturally occuring virus resulting from an Avian type A, a Pig type A, and a Human type A hybridizing in a pig. This is because Pigs can catch all three types of influenza and they mix. There is nothing spooky about it.
Secondly, except in Mexico, this doesn't seem very dangerous, most people are getting mild cases. No adults who have caught it, other than in Mexico, have died, and very few people have caught it outside of Mexico.
Finally, there is no vaccine for it, it will take at least 3 months to produce one. There is also no vaccine for H5N1, there is a vaccine that is believed to help resistance to it, but it is not a H5N1 Vaccine, and it's not made by Baxter. The Baxter incident iinvolved accidental comtamination of an experimental H3N2 vaccine that ended up killing the test subjects resulkting in red flags that lead to the discovery of the problem. I am sure the ferrets were very upset by the problem, but no humans came close to being infected or hurt.
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Ian Pearse
Mars
Apollo (and space) enthusiast
Posts: 308
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Post by Ian Pearse on Apr 30, 2009 8:11:22 GMT -4
WHO info says 3 to 6 months to isolate, test and mass-produce a vaccine for this. In the meantime, existing general antivirals like Tamiflu seem to help those infected, if administered quickly. The best defence is common sense and good personal hygeine. As for camps, the LAST thing any organisation would do with an infectious disease is put huge numbers of people in close confinement with each other - what a load of Tosh!
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Post by echnaton on Apr 30, 2009 10:09:25 GMT -4
Here in Houston with our close proximity to Mexico and large population of Mexican nationals we are rather concerned about these developments. Three schools have been closed. Two were on the precaution because some student had had flu like symptoms. The third was closed after the sick student had already recovered from swine flu. It will reopen in a few days. Houston also had the first US death. A young Mexican child brought by parents to the US for health care. Every case contracted in Houston so far has been non life threatening. Most recover in a few days at home. Cases are largely traced back to Mexico. No one yet knows why the US cases are mild compared to the illnesses in Mexico. The most drastic action anyone is likely to take are like those already taken in Mexico. Close down non-essential public places and events so people stay at home. Chicken little alarmist like you DH, are likely add to the harm. Panic is not a good thing in cases like this. Precaution in what saves people. This is a friendly alert. Please check out this information before killing the messenger. Passing on rumors and lies, like you are doing, is not a friendly act. Don't expect your lame disclaimer to generate much sympathy.
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Post by Dead Hoosiers on Apr 30, 2009 10:48:37 GMT -4
The danger isn't that this flu is a killer--it may well not be. The danger I'm concerned with is that the government may grab onto this as an excuse to force people to take a vaccine.
This virus so far has a low kill rate and is being overhyped. It in no way justifies a Level 5 alert by the WHO.
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Post by Dead Hoosiers on Apr 30, 2009 11:12:54 GMT -4
Peter B, you might want to do some research on vaccine dangers before getting one. There isn't a vaccine for this flu right now, so what you'll be taking won't be effective, yet it may have damaging effects.
Regarding camps, they would be used for people who refuse a mandatory vaccine--they would be rounded up and quarantined in the interests of public safety. This is what has me worried. In California there have already been reports of people with symptoms being taken to a "safe place." Our government tried to mandate vaccines for a flu outbreak back in 1976 under president Gerald Ford. One one person died from the flu. Twenty-five people died from taking the vaccine.
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Post by Apollo Gnomon on Apr 30, 2009 11:25:49 GMT -4
From the "horse's mouth," the WHO website: Phase 5 is characterized by human-to-human spread of the virus into at least two countries in one WHO region. While most countries will not be affected at this stage, the declaration of Phase 5 is a strong signal that a pandemic is imminent and that the time to finalize the organization, communication, and implementation of the planned mitigation measures is short. www.who.int/csr/disease/avian_influenza/phase/en/index.htmlThis has nothing to do with "kill rate" but the rate of transmission. Um, would you rather have these people coughing on the tomatoes at the grocery store? I listen to Jones on AM radio sometimes. I can generally stand about 5 minutes of his overly-broad "we know this (unsubstantiated statement) is true, therefor (hairball theory)" logic. He's utterly paranoid, and justifies his fear with bizarre ideas about the "New World Order" and their goals. The supposed goals make no sense - mass arrests and murders of multitudes. {edit - link to WHO added}
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Post by echnaton on Apr 30, 2009 11:28:16 GMT -4
The danger isn't that this flu is a killer--it may well not be. The danger I'm concerned with is that the government may grab onto this as an excuse to force people to take a vaccine. But you are always and unreasonably concerned with this. You tie your fantasies to any incident then raise an alarm. Raising an alarm about the results of a swine flu pandemic is raising an alarm about a swine flu pandemic. Because people make decision based on the projected results of an pandemic, not the virus itself. Don't be such a weasel.
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Post by echnaton on Apr 30, 2009 11:29:05 GMT -4
This virus so far has a low kill rate and is being overhyped. It in no way justifies a Level 5 alert by the WHO. What is a Level 5 alert and why does this not fit the criteria? ETA, I see Apollo Gnomon answered my question while I was typing. So DH in your expert opinion, why does this definition not apply?
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