Post by wdmundt on Oct 31, 2007 17:31:35 GMT -4
I guess you've really nailed the conservative talking points, Jason. Good job.
No, let's not. It's great to see a conservative stand up for someone from the military taking a political attack. Or, as usual, not standing up for the person from the military if he is not a Republican.
The main claim of the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth was that Kerry had lied about being under fire during an action in which he was wounded. SBVT claimed that there was no enemy fire that day.
Jim Rassmann, a Republican, was blown out of his boat and pulled from the water by John Kerry during the battle in question. Here is what he had to say:
To avoid the incoming fire, I repeatedly swam under water as long as I could hold my breath, attempting to make it to the north bank of the river. I thought I would die right there. The odds were against me avoiding the incoming fire and, even if I made it out of the river, I thought I'd be captured and executed. Kerry must have seen me in the water and directed his driver, Del Sandusky, to turn the boat around. Kerry's boat ran up to me in the water, bow on, and I was able to climb up a cargo net to the lip of the deck… I couldn't make it over the edge of the deck. This left me hanging out in the open, a perfect target. John, already wounded by the explosion that threw me off his boat, came out onto the bow, exposing himself to the fire directed at us from the jungle, and pulled me aboard.
and...
I am neither a politician nor an organizer. I am a retired police officer with a passion for orchids… But in this presidential election, I had to speak out; I had to tell the American people about John Kerry, about his wisdom and courage, about his vision and leadership. I would trust John Kerry with my life, and I would entrust John Kerry with the well-being of our country.
His whole article is here:
www.truthout.org/docs_04/081104L.shtml
Larry Thurlow, a member of the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth, was in one of the boats involved in the action that day. He claims that Kerry "fled the scene" and returned only later "when it was apparent that there was no return fire." Unfortunately, Thurlow’s own citation from the battle that day states "all units began receiving enemy small arms and automatic weapons fire from the river banks" after the first boat was hit. Oops.
All of the members of Kerry’s crew support the official account, not the account of the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth. The official action report, Kerry's crew, the man in the water and the official citation of one of Kerry's political enemies all point to Kerry telling the truth and the Swift Boaters being jackasses.
I guess you haven’t read his testimony. In the testimony, Kerry is describing what other veterans reported during the “Winter Soldier Investigation.” Kerry says, “They told the stories at times they had personally raped, cut off ears, cut off heads, tape wires from portable telephones to human genitals and turned up the power, cut off limbs, blown up bodies….”
He was not laying the blame on the soldiers, however. He was placing it on those who sent them into a useless war and told them to fight it that way. It is typical of conservatives to quote out of context and to twist words to mean the opposite of their intentions and that is what has happened here.
Kerry – “Each day to facilitate the process by which the United States washes her hands of Vietnam someone has to give up his life so that the United States doesn't have to admit something that the entire world already knows, so that we can't say that we have made a mistake. Someone has to die so that President Nixon won't be, and these are his words, "the first President to lose a war." We are asking Americans to think about that because how do you ask a man to be the last man to dies in Vietnam? How do ask a man to be the last man to die for a mistake?”
He never claimed they were his medals. He has said they were a friend’s. He has always openly displayed his own medals.
His supporters say his claims are grossly inaccurate? Gosh, I must not be watching Fox News enough.
Right. He should wear shoes made from old shirts and live in a shack. How dare he have a big house? And what a stupid argument that is. It is as dumb as the one about John Edwards being too wealthy to be a champion of the poor. So I guess by that logic anyone who supports the war in Iraq should sign up with the military. Have you? (and I sincerely apologize if you have)
How is that?
Leaving aside the accusations of the Swift Boat Veterans, for the moment:
No, let's not. It's great to see a conservative stand up for someone from the military taking a political attack. Or, as usual, not standing up for the person from the military if he is not a Republican.
The main claim of the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth was that Kerry had lied about being under fire during an action in which he was wounded. SBVT claimed that there was no enemy fire that day.
Jim Rassmann, a Republican, was blown out of his boat and pulled from the water by John Kerry during the battle in question. Here is what he had to say:
To avoid the incoming fire, I repeatedly swam under water as long as I could hold my breath, attempting to make it to the north bank of the river. I thought I would die right there. The odds were against me avoiding the incoming fire and, even if I made it out of the river, I thought I'd be captured and executed. Kerry must have seen me in the water and directed his driver, Del Sandusky, to turn the boat around. Kerry's boat ran up to me in the water, bow on, and I was able to climb up a cargo net to the lip of the deck… I couldn't make it over the edge of the deck. This left me hanging out in the open, a perfect target. John, already wounded by the explosion that threw me off his boat, came out onto the bow, exposing himself to the fire directed at us from the jungle, and pulled me aboard.
and...
I am neither a politician nor an organizer. I am a retired police officer with a passion for orchids… But in this presidential election, I had to speak out; I had to tell the American people about John Kerry, about his wisdom and courage, about his vision and leadership. I would trust John Kerry with my life, and I would entrust John Kerry with the well-being of our country.
His whole article is here:
www.truthout.org/docs_04/081104L.shtml
Larry Thurlow, a member of the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth, was in one of the boats involved in the action that day. He claims that Kerry "fled the scene" and returned only later "when it was apparent that there was no return fire." Unfortunately, Thurlow’s own citation from the battle that day states "all units began receiving enemy small arms and automatic weapons fire from the river banks" after the first boat was hit. Oops.
All of the members of Kerry’s crew support the official account, not the account of the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth. The official action report, Kerry's crew, the man in the water and the official citation of one of Kerry's political enemies all point to Kerry telling the truth and the Swift Boaters being jackasses.
Initially built his political career on his lies before Congress about the conduct of US soldiers in Vietnam, mostly accusations of torture and mass murder that he had no actual first hand knowledge of.
I guess you haven’t read his testimony. In the testimony, Kerry is describing what other veterans reported during the “Winter Soldier Investigation.” Kerry says, “They told the stories at times they had personally raped, cut off ears, cut off heads, tape wires from portable telephones to human genitals and turned up the power, cut off limbs, blown up bodies….”
He was not laying the blame on the soldiers, however. He was placing it on those who sent them into a useless war and told them to fight it that way. It is typical of conservatives to quote out of context and to twist words to mean the opposite of their intentions and that is what has happened here.
Kerry – “Each day to facilitate the process by which the United States washes her hands of Vietnam someone has to give up his life so that the United States doesn't have to admit something that the entire world already knows, so that we can't say that we have made a mistake. Someone has to die so that President Nixon won't be, and these are his words, "the first President to lose a war." We are asking Americans to think about that because how do you ask a man to be the last man to dies in Vietnam? How do ask a man to be the last man to die for a mistake?”
Was seen on national TV throwing his medals over the White House fence in protest but later admitted it was actually someone else's medals.
He never claimed they were his medals. He has said they were a friend’s. He has always openly displayed his own medals.
The modern Trofim Lysenko, a non-scientist always eager to use whatever means he can to push his crackpot claims that even his supporters admit are grossly inaccurate.
His supporters say his claims are grossly inaccurate? Gosh, I must not be watching Fox News enough.
A complete hypocrite, living a lifestyle completely at odds with what he preaches to his admirers.
Right. He should wear shoes made from old shirts and live in a shack. How dare he have a big house? And what a stupid argument that is. It is as dumb as the one about John Edwards being too wealthy to be a champion of the poor. So I guess by that logic anyone who supports the war in Iraq should sign up with the military. Have you? (and I sincerely apologize if you have)
Also a sore loser.
How is that?