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Post by lionking on May 31, 2010 9:44:44 GMT -4
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Jason
Pluto
May all your hits be crits
Posts: 5,579
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Post by Jason on May 31, 2010 16:09:48 GMT -4
The Israelis are not the real terrorists. They in fact have the ability to nuke their enemies and yet refrain from doing so. The same cannot be said for their enemies.
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Post by LunarOrbit on May 31, 2010 16:21:03 GMT -4
They in fact have the ability to nuke their enemies and yet refrain from doing so. The same cannot be said for their enemies. Who have Israels enemies nuked? |
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Post by Ginnie on May 31, 2010 19:13:27 GMT -4
The links aren't working for me, Lionking.
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Post by lionking on Jun 1, 2010 2:12:52 GMT -4
this is for you Ginnie
Jason's response isn't worth replying to
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Post by PhantomWolf on Jun 1, 2010 7:25:54 GMT -4
Let's see.....
Israel is at war with the Goverment of Palestine and so is blockading them.
Ships declare that they are going to run the blockade.
Israelis say that they will stop them if they continue and offer alternative.
Ships refuse and try anyway.
Israelis stop them and not expecting more than passive resistance board armed only with paintball rifles and handguns as backup.
Five of the ships get diverted without incidence.
One crew attacks the boarders as they land using marbles fired from slingshots, knives, pipes, stun grenades, firebombs, handguns ripped off the boarders who have been knocked down, and a rifle. They also tie the boarding ropes to the ship's mast in an attempt to bring the helicopter down, and throw one dazed commando off the top deck to the one below seriously injuring him.
So with all of this, the Israelis are the terrorists for them defending themselves?
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Post by PeterB on Jun 1, 2010 8:36:57 GMT -4
Let's see..... Israel is at war with the Goverment of Palestine and so is blockading them. Well, this is the thing. Is Israel at war with the Government of Palestine? Is the blockade legal? If not, is the Israeli boarding action piracy? I find it a bit hard for people to attempt to seize an objective, yet claim they're defending themselves. Yes, I realise I'm conflating the boarding action and the subsequent violence, but it still sounds like that old Soviet description of "attacking in self-defence". |
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Post by lionking on Jun 1, 2010 8:41:12 GMT -4
1-the blockade is in the first place inhuman, starving people and depriving women and children from access to food and health care products
2-the ship came in peace but was attacked by the Israelis in violence. had the ship been allowed to approach the coastlines and deliver the help and get back peacefully, nothing would have happened. but the terrorists whom the world think are whiter than white insist on starving innocent civilians and on killing veryone trying to offer them help. this si the truth of the subject
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Post by PeterB on Jun 1, 2010 8:42:18 GMT -4
The action was undertaken by Israel. Why are these people angry at the USA? I'm sure there are people out there who, no matter what the situation, will find a way to blame the USA for it. In case they weren't watching, the US didn't congratulate Israel. |
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Post by PeterB on Jun 1, 2010 8:45:57 GMT -4
...but the terrorists whom the world think are whiter than white insist on starving innocent civilians and on killing veryone trying to offer them help. this si the truth of the subject This is the same Gaza from which rockets are regularly launched against any target in Israel, usually civilian. What should Israel do to stop these attacks? The last two times Israel traded land for peace (Southern Lebanon and Gaza) they gave up the land but didn't get peace. |
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Post by echnaton on Jun 1, 2010 9:25:45 GMT -4
1-the blockade is in the first place inhuman, starving people and depriving women and children from access to food and health care products Governments that care about the safety of their civilian population put their military in uniform and take actions from segregated military installations. TPTB in Gaza do not do take these precautions and thus have a significant role in the fate of the population of Gaza. If TPHB would declare permanent Gazan borders and vow to fight only to defend them and follow that vow, I believe world opinion would turn their way and the violence would stop. I question if the external Islamic and Arab religious and political powers that control what passes for a government in Gaza would allow this to happen. While Israel contributes to the conflict, the contributions are not unilateral and focusing on Israel alone will only further the conflict. |
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Post by PhantomWolf on Jun 1, 2010 9:28:45 GMT -4
Let's see..... Israel is at war with the Goverment of Palestine and so is blockading them. Well, this is the thing. Is Israel at war with the Government of Palestine? Yes, in fact the act of blockading in itself is an act of war. A blockage is legal if the blockading force attempts to stop all traffic not just some, and it would appear that Israel is in fact doing this, so within the definition (which is admittedly vague) then it would appear to be a yes. Even if it wasn't, the boarding of suspect ships by miltary forces is not necessarily piracy. In 2006 a US boarding party in International waters off Somalia came under fire, and returned fire killing 1 and unjuring 5. Was that self defence? The footage from both the Activists and the IDF is clear, the Israelis were attacked the moment they boarded. The act of board was not violent, and the commandos were holding non-lethal paint guns. They were attacked before doing anything over than coming aboard. This was by a group claiming to be "peace activists" (though they had previously stated that they would "get to Gaza or become Martyrs trying.") |
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Post by PhantomWolf on Jun 1, 2010 9:37:24 GMT -4
1-the blockade is in the first place inhuman, starving people and depriving women and children from access to food and health care products Food and medical supplies are not included in the blockade and are regularly supplied . No it wasn't attacked violently, it was boarded after refusing to stop for inspection at a blockade, and the passangers responded by attacking the boarders as they slid down ropes onto the deck. They used pipes, knives, chairs, stun grenades, fire bombs, and shot marbles with sling shots. They managed to knock two commandoes down, take their backup handguns, shoot one and throw the other from the top deck. At that point the only violence from the IDF was the use of paint balls to try and disperse the crowd, which failed. Once the activists started firing the handguns and a rifle that was onboard, the IDF responded in kind. The Israelis were fully within the law to stop them. San Remo Manual on International Law Applicable to Armed Conflicts at Sea, 12 June 1994 |
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Jason
Pluto
May all your hits be crits
Posts: 5,579
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Post by Jason on Jun 1, 2010 11:41:38 GMT -4
They in fact have the ability to nuke their enemies and yet refrain from doing so. The same cannot be said for their enemies. Who have Israels enemies nuked? If you paid close attention my statement had two parts. Israel's enemies do not as of yet have the ability to nuke their enemies, but do you think their enemies would refrain from using a nuke against Israel if they were able to obtain one? And Lionking, you are letting your regional prejudices get the better of you. Of course it's difficult for you to empathize in any way with Israel, given where you come from. |
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Post by laurel on Jun 1, 2010 12:53:50 GMT -4
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