Watch the HB ignore and hand wave this one away

[PhantomWolf]

Mystery in Apollo Return Samples solved by Genisis

Ever since astronauts returned from another world, scientists have been mystified by some of the moon rocks they brought back. Now one of the mysteries has been solved.

As etching proceeded, the results were almost identical to those found in many lunar samples

I guess the guys with their Radioactive ovens did an increadible job, even thinking of a way to replicate an experiment that hadn't been thought of, for a probe that hadn't been thought of at the time of Apollo. Even better, the scientist conducting the experiment is from Zurich. ;D

[reynoldbot]

here's a good hand wave: "NASA routinely re-fakes and replaces the moon rocks every time a new test is concocted."

[3onthetree]

OK, I'll bite. What the .... , have they run out of Moon. Hello, I can still see it and it looks like it still has stuff on it. Or is that a new moon. If you want to compare Lunar samples the best place to start I think would be the actual Lunar surface, not L1.

[gwiz]

3onthetree said:

OK, I'll bite. What the .... , have they run out of Moon. Hello, I can still see it and it looks like it still has stuff on it. Or is that a new moon. If you want to compare Lunar samples the best place to start I think would be the actual Lunar surface, not L1.

How about reading the link before you comment? The question is one of how the solar wind interacts with the lunar surface, solved by retrieving a known surface sample that had also interacted with the solar wind.

[3onthetree]

gwiz said:

3onthetree said:

OK, I'll bite. What the .... , have they run out of Moon. Hello, I can still see it and it looks like it still has stuff on it. Or is that a new moon. If you want to compare Lunar samples the best place to start I think would be the actual Lunar surface, not L1.

How about reading the link before you comment? The question is one of how the solar wind interacts with the lunar surface, solved by retrieving a known surface sample that had also interacted with the solar wind.

I did! I'll rephrase it. If you wanted to examine the effects of solar solar wind on the lunar surface the best place to start would be the Lunar surface. Big difference between free-space and the surface of a Moon considering all the other interactions.

[gwiz]

3onthetree said:

gwiz said:

How about reading the link before you comment? The question is one of how the solar wind interacts with the lunar surface, solved by retrieving a known surface sample that had also interacted with the solar wind.

I did! I'll rephrase it. If you wanted to examine the effects of solar solar wind on the lunar surface the best place to start would be the Lunar surface. Big difference between free-space and the surface of a Moon considering all the other interactions.

If you'd read the link, you'd understand that the new data with a known surface sample removes a lot of the unknowns from the results of the examination of the lunar samples. This is a standard technique in science - simplifying a complex situation by setting up an experiment where you have more control of the various parameters and can thus investigate their individual effects.

[tofu]

3onthetree said:

If you wanted to examine the effects of solar solar wind on the lunar surface the best place to start would be the Lunar surface.

Let me just stop you right there. You're doing EXACTLY what gwiz said you would do.

Genesis had nothing to do with studying the Moon. You're statement above shows that you still don't get it.

Genesis studied the solar wind. Now, with this new solar wind data, the scientists are saying, "oooohhhhh! This is explains something we saw in Apollo rocks! Cool!"

Big difference between free-space and the surface of a Moon considering all the other interactions.

You're really smart. You should email this idiot in Zurich and tell him that you figured out something that he didn't know - that his PhD in astrophysics and years of scientific work means nothing compared to your high-school science class that you slept through. Because I'm sure he's completely unaware of any differences between the Moon and interplanetary space, and I'm sure that all the academic papers that he's published in peer reviewed scientific journals were actually written by a monkey randomly banging away at a typewriter. Yes, the authority that he has as part of a project that put a probe into outer space and collected material from the solar wind is nothing compared to the authority you have as someone who can use Internet Explorer and click the Reply button.

[3onthetree]

Let me just stop you right there. You're doing EXACTLY what gwiz said you would do.

Genesis had nothing to do with studying the Moon. You're statement above shows that you still don't get it.

Genesis studied the solar wind. Now, with this new solar wind data, the scientists are saying, "oooohhhhh! This is explains something we saw in Apollo rocks! Cool!"

Fair enough, I jumped the gun a bit. Simply because seeing the samples that went splat suddenly turn up in support of Apollo activated my implanted HB chip.

[PhantomWolf]

Simply because seeing the samples that went splat

Which goes to show you haven't been keeping up with the project. While about 40-50% of the samples were too broken to be of use, the rest were okay, but suffered from having a layer of contamination, from outgassing by the broken craft, over them. Those in the project have spent the last year working out how to remove that layer and get good results, now we're starting to get the results.

Also while the result supports Apollo, it wasn't intended too, in fact is actually disagrees with what scientists thought based solely on the Apollo Samples. If you read the article you'll see that due to space weathering, the Apollo samples didn't have as much ²²Ne in their surfaces as the Genisis experiment would predict. What that meant was from the Apollo samples it appeared that there had been more energetic bursts of solar wind in the past. This experiment has shown that this is wrong, that the particles are in the normal solar wind and that the Apollo samples received their Ne from the normal impact of the wind rather then from the previously thought high velocity winds of the past. The experiment is about the Sun and solar wind than anything to do with validating Apollo, it just happens that as an aside it confirms the Apollo data by proving that the rocks were from the lunar enviroment rather than being baked in an oven. That and scientists get to slap their foreheads and go, "Doh! So thaaaaaat's what happens."

[Mr Gorsky]

phantomwolf said:

That and scientists get to slap their foreheads and go, "Doh! So thaaaaaat's what happens.

Wow. I didn't know they reeeeally did that ...

[AstroSmurf]

Only on a good day

[BertL]

So the headaches aren't from thinking after all!

[Count Zero]

"No brain, no pain!"

[BertL]

Wow, PhantomWolf, after reading 3onthetree's replies I have watched the HB try to hand wave this one away.