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Post by frenat on Mar 27, 2006 19:42:22 GMT -4
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Post by frenat on Mar 28, 2006 0:22:38 GMT -4
I was strolling through some of Jack's other posts on the Education forum and found this gem. Although it was written regarding the JFK topic, I think it sums up how he feels about those that don't agree with him.
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lenbrazil
Saturn
Now there's a man with an open mind - you can feel the breeze from here!
Posts: 1,045
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Post by lenbrazil on Mar 28, 2006 8:11:52 GMT -4
I was strolling through some of Jack's other posts on the Education forum and found this gem. Although it was written regarding the JFK topic, I think it sums up how he feels about those that don't agree with him. I think he feels that way because we make such a fool of him, not that he doesn't do a good job of that all by himself. |
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Post by scooter on Mar 28, 2006 9:42:55 GMT -4
Many years back, as I was beginning my USAF career, I ran practice intercepts controlling F-106 and F-101 aircraft. The radars in these jets weren't particularly powerful, and any edge the pilots could get during the intercept was an advantage. We were always aware of the "contrail level", the altitude band in the atmosphere in a particular area where contrails could be expected. Seeing the target's contrail well before the radar could lock up the target made things much easier for the pilots. Contrails can be "predicted".
As for contrails on the ground, the vapor trails often seen in humid weather trailing from wingtips and flap edges are low pressure vortexes which cause the moisture to condense. Sometimes large "clouds" flash-form briefly over aircraft wings in high lift situations in takeoff and landing, somewhat startling to observers not familiar with the phenomenon. Not really "contrails" per se...
Sorry Jack, you are 100% flailing in ignorance on this one...and really making a fool of yourself.
(EDIT: Someone needs to get Jack some high altitude enroute charts...not that he'd see the connection...)
Dave
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Al Johnston
"Cheer up!" they said, "It could be worse!" So I did, and it was.
Posts: 1,453
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Post by Al Johnston on Mar 28, 2006 10:12:55 GMT -4
Johnnie Johnson's autobiography describes Spitfire pilots using similar tactics on offensive sweeps during WWII: they would climb to the height at which they were starting to make contrails and then drop down so they weren't: making it easier to see if they were about to be "bounced" from above.
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Al Johnston
"Cheer up!" they said, "It could be worse!" So I did, and it was.
Posts: 1,453
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Post by Al Johnston on Mar 28, 2006 10:15:15 GMT -4
Sometimes large "clouds" flash-form briefly over aircraft wings in high lift situations in takeoff and landing, somewhat startling to observers not familiar with the phenomenon. Not really "contrails" per se... Quite spectacularly sometimes:  |
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Post by sts60 on Mar 28, 2006 13:49:45 GMT -4
I read the thread referenced in the OP.
Wow. In just a few posts, Mr. White put on a classic demonstration of temperamental self-assurance and absolutely clueless blithering.
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Post by frenat on Mar 28, 2006 20:42:52 GMT -4
Many years back, as I was beginning my USAF career, I ran practice intercepts controlling F-106 and F-101 aircraft. The radars in these jets weren't particularly powerful, and any edge the pilots could get during the intercept was an advantage. We were always aware of the "contrail level", the altitude band in the atmosphere in a particular area where contrails could be expected. Seeing the target's contrail well before the radar could lock up the target made things much easier for the pilots. Contrails can be "predicted". As for contrails on the ground, the vapor trails often seen in humid weather trailing from wingtips and flap edges are low pressure vortexes which cause the moisture to condense. Sometimes large "clouds" flash-form briefly over aircraft wings in high lift situations in takeoff and landing, somewhat startling to observers not familiar with the phenomenon. Not really "contrails" per se... Sorry Jack, you are 100% flailing in ignorance on this one...and really making a fool of yourself. (EDIT: Someone needs to get Jack some high altitude enroute charts...not that he'd see the connection...) Dave I am an Air Battle Manager in the air force and from my time at Tyndall working with the F-15s there I can tell you they still brief the contrail altitudes before each sortie. GCI is expected to know them as well. A good call to a student pilot that was having trouble locating an enemy in the contrail layer would be "check cons". Jack seems to think he knows everything about everything and can't possibly be wrong. I have a feeling that I'm not too far away from being a NOBODY in his eyes. I'm so worried, I just might cry. Wait....I'm over it. ;D |
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lenbrazil
Saturn
Now there's a man with an open mind - you can feel the breeze from here!
Posts: 1,045
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Post by lenbrazil on Feb 14, 2007 14:35:06 GMT -4
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Post by echnaton on Feb 14, 2007 21:34:57 GMT -4
It would surprise me if White believed anything that could be shown to be even an approximation of the truth. It seems that he just heads the other way when science comes in front of him.
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Post by gillianren on Feb 14, 2007 22:20:43 GMT -4
My brain!
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lenbrazil
Saturn
Now there's a man with an open mind - you can feel the breeze from here!
Posts: 1,045
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Post by lenbrazil on Feb 16, 2007 19:28:17 GMT -4
I should have included a warning with my last post, "clicking this link may cause temporary brain injury or possibly even permanent damage!". “Debating” Jack causes my brain to hurt too! All that shaking my head in disbelief, rolling on the floor laughing my @$$ off, slapping my forehead and rolling my eyes takes its toll. |
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Post by dumbtechie on Feb 16, 2007 22:04:19 GMT -4
I wonder if White is aware that the formation and behavior of contrails is the subject of real, ongoing scientific research and has been since World War II. The military has an obvious reason to be interested in the subject, since the development of aircraft that could fly high enough to produce contrails led to the realization that the trails were effectively a giant sign reading "ATTENTION ENEMY PERSONS! THIS IS WHERE WE ARE!". The increase in contrails due to the growth of civil aviation has made it a more interesting subject for meteorologists and climate scientists because of the potential effects of artificially increased cloud cover on surface temperatures. Here's a site with lots of information about current work on improving our ability to forecast the formation of persistent contrails with a view to abating them: contrail.gi.alaska.edu/If Mr. White were to peruse some of the papers that can be downloaded from the "publications" page, he could find out a lot about how and why contrails form, persist, dissipate and sometimes form layers of cirrus cloud. |
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Post by frenat on Feb 16, 2007 23:33:00 GMT -4
Certainly Jack "could" learn something. But Jack won't do that because in his mind, Jack is always right.
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