raven
Jupiter
That ain't Earth, kiddies.
Posts: 509
|
Post by raven on Mar 8, 2009 21:46:27 GMT -4
If I understand correctly, samples were also sent to Soviet scientists, who had samples of their own to compare them to. That's sounds pretty independent to me.
|
|
|
Post by tedward on Mar 9, 2009 4:32:57 GMT -4
Interesting. Even without the link on page one, a few searches start to turn up names (from a UK perspective) that have examined and carried out research on the returns.
But I would have thought the biggest giveaway would be the outcry from the rest of the world if the US had faked the rocks and published and no chance of the rest checking the claims. That is, prove it! If you see what I mean.
|
|
|
Post by Jairo on Mar 9, 2009 9:13:22 GMT -4
The striking feature that can be seen under a microscope is the large number of glass spherules of many colours caused by rock melted either by ancient volcanic action or by meteorite bombardment. These spherules would not form or survive on the Earth because air and water would make them disintegrate. (and no - they could not be made artificially), Could you explain what are the problems involved in making them artificially? Thanks.
|
|
|
Post by gwiz on Mar 9, 2009 13:29:29 GMT -4
Could you explain what are the problems involved in making them artificially? I think one of the problems is the age of the glass, billions of years, then there are the cosmic ray tracks and the micrometeorite pits in the glass. According to this site"It was easier and cheaper to go to the Moon and bring back some rocks then it would have been to create all these fascinating features on Earth."
|
|
|
Post by fiveonit on Mar 17, 2009 23:24:10 GMT -4
Dear lord... where do these people come from?? Here's yet another youtube'r that I've been arguing with about moon rocks. I post this for your enjoyment...
poster:Did you know that two years before the Apollo 11 mission, its lead scientist Dr. Werner Van Braun (nazi scientist) made a trip to Antartica which is a prime area for collection Moon rocks?
me:They're not Moon Rocks, they're meteorites. They have scars of entry through the earth's atmosphere and are subject to weathering from the elements. Your average 10 year old could tell the difference between those and actual moon samples.
The samples brought back from Apollo have been examined from Geologist from all over the world over the past 40 years. NOT ONE has ever said they were fake or claimed they *might be* lunar meteorites.
Lunar meteorites are also extremely rare!
poster:You can irradiate a rock or put it in a vacuum to get the same results
me:Oh really?? Can you now?
Tell you what... why don't you explain to me (in detail) the process for FAKING moon rocks. Also describe to me this magical oven used in the creation of these fake rocks and how it wipes out all signs of Earth weathering. It also needs to wipe out all signs of solidifying from lunar magma in 1/6th gravity. Also scars from micro meteor impacts.
I'll just wait here for your reply...
poster:I can refer you to the scientific explanation for doing that. Or just google it!
me:No... that's OK. You seem to be very well versed in this subject. I'll just sit here and wait for your detailed explanation.
10 hours later... dead silence.
I wonder if he even noticed that I goofed... I should have said.. It also needs to create signs of solidifying from lunar magma in 1/6th gravity. Also scars from micro meteor impacts.
|
|
|
Post by gillianren on Mar 18, 2009 13:43:41 GMT -4
You know, you can't Google it. I'd be surprised if he could even point you to a scientific explanation. This is because no one's ever come up with one. They've come up with handwaves about radiation ovens, but no one has ever explained in any kind of detail how the thing would work.
|
|
|
Post by tomblvd on Mar 18, 2009 20:58:01 GMT -4
fiveonit, do you have a link to that youtube discussion?
Thanks
|
|
|
Post by PhantomWolf on Mar 19, 2009 2:08:28 GMT -4
The fun question about the "Von Braun got the samples from Antartica" is "how did a rocket scientist with no geology experience know which Antartic meteorites were lunar based and which martian or asteriod based two years prior to the study of any Lunar samples and 10 years before the discovery of Lunarites in Antartica by anyone else?"
|
|
|
Post by nomuse on Mar 19, 2009 2:14:15 GMT -4
He's a rocket scientist; he can do anything! (Except paint the right stars on a backdrop.)
|
|
|
Post by tedward on Mar 19, 2009 4:18:07 GMT -4
The nazi tag (in fiveonit commentary) does get used a lot in an attempt to bolster claims and demonise people. I wonder if they have dug through history and found other business links to the regime and how their lives have interacted with them (in their current form) today? I wonder I said, I shouldn't wonder more like. Not a pop at the businesses today or what happened then, awful time in history and this is not the place.
Also not only accepting a rocket scientist picking up moon rocks (I know, I know) but not that said scientist knows anything about rockets. Moving the goal posts.
|
|
|
Post by ineluki on Mar 19, 2009 8:19:35 GMT -4
The fun question about the "Von Braun got the samples from Antartica" is "; And the idea that an action like this would be done by the most "prominent" figure of the Apollo-program is perhaps even more idiotic.
|
|
raven
Jupiter
That ain't Earth, kiddies.
Posts: 509
|
Post by raven on Mar 19, 2009 10:56:57 GMT -4
The fun question about the "Von Braun got the samples from Antartica" is "; And the idea that an action like this would be done by the most "prominent" figure of the Apollo-program is perhaps even more idiotic. Evil Overlords don't know how to delegate.
|
|
Jason
Pluto
May all your hits be crits
Posts: 5,579
|
Post by Jason on Mar 19, 2009 11:12:03 GMT -4
NASA Planning room: 1st Shadowy Figure: "Okay, so we need to get some real moon rocks if we're going to pull this off. We'll have to send someone to Antarctica to collect some moon meteors. Who have we got that can do this discretly?" 2nd Shadowy Figure: "Well, we've got this prominent ex-Nazi rocket scientist. Why don't we send him?" 1st SF: "It's PERFECT! No one will suspect a rocket scientist of collecting rocks! And if sometime in the future his visit is discovered, everyone will think that the fact that the guy was an ex-Nazi is too bizarre to be true." 2nd SF: "And once we have some real moon rocks we can tune the radiation oven, which was also designed by our ex-Nazi rocket scientist, to duplicate what we see."
|
|
raven
Jupiter
That ain't Earth, kiddies.
Posts: 509
|
Post by raven on Mar 19, 2009 17:26:11 GMT -4
NASA Planning room: 1st Shadowy Figure: "Okay, so we need to get some real moon rocks if we're going to pull this off. We'll have to send someone to Antarctica to collect some moon meteors. Who have we got that can do this discretly?" 2nd Shadowy Figure: "Well, we've got this prominent ex-Nazi rocket scientist. Why don't we send him?" 1st SF: "It's PERFECT! No one will suspect a rocket scientist of collecting rocks! And if sometime in the future his visit is discovered, everyone will think that the fact that the guy was an ex-Nazi is too bizarre to be true." 2nd SF: "And once we have some real moon rocks we can tune the radiation oven, which was also designed by our ex-Nazi rocket scientist, to duplicate what we see." 3rd Shadowy Figure: But most of the Antarctic meteorites are asteroidal, how will we tell the difference in case the Soviets go and scoop up some GENUINE moon rocks from the moon? 1st & 2nd SF: Quiet you.
|
|
|
Post by laurel on Mar 19, 2009 17:58:12 GMT -4
I wonder how the shadowy figures created all those lunar soil samples? AFAIK, the "lunar meteorites from Antarctica" explanation doesn't explain those.
|
|