Saturn V rocket needed to be 266 times bigger.

[3onthetree]

But this particular piece of nonsense has been kicking around since 1941 , and occasionally surfaces...

Mainly because the US did everything in their power to provoke the Japanese, the fact that the battle of Britain was won by the British mainly because of a little invention called Radar which was shared with the US. Apart from all the decoding there were warnings from Australian intelligence that a Japanese fleet was headed for Hawaii three days before the attack.

[Count Zero]

Aside from being wrong on nearly every point, what does any of this have to do with the Saturn V?

[Sticks]

colinr said:

What's next Moon Man - Churchill Knew coventry was the target of an air raid , and made no effort to evacuate - because in doing so he would have tipped off the Germans to the fact we were able to read Enigma decripts ... Yes I know that piece of rubbish as well ....

They referenced that CT on an episode of Babylon 5, so what was the debunking of that one? If there is another thread for this let me know as we are straying off topic here which was about the Saturn 5 and Sibrels claims.

[colinr]

OK my last post off topic -

the facts - as revealed in RV Joneses book" Most Secret War" , was that the Enigma decrypts pointed to a major raid on one of a list of 5 industrial cities in the midlands - there was nothing in the Decrypt to reveal what these 5 cities were - it wasn't until the bomber stream appeared over Coventry that the final piece of the puzzle fell into place .

RV was for many years the professor of Physics at Aberdeen University , my home town , before that he was senior science adviser to the air ministry , and was instrumental in , among other things identifying German Radar operations - a true insider ..

and on that note I'll return you to Moon Man's fantasy world!

[Obviousman]

Colinr,

To my knowledge, the Coventry story is correct. I'll double check, but i think it is accurate.

***********

Oooh! An Australian aspect! At last! let me check my reference material about a warning, and I'll get back to you.

[Tanalia]

Code Breakers - The Inside Story of Bletchley Park, edited by F.H. Hinsley and Alan Stripp (officials from Bletchley Park):

There was a story, which can still be heard from time to time, that it was known that Coventry was to be the target for a devastating raid, and that Churchill forbade any special precautions for fear of giving away the all important secret that we were reading the Enigma. What Churchill would have done had he been confronted with this terrible dilemma I have, of course, no idea. But it so happens that we did not know the target for that night until it was too late; in fact, as I remember, we were expecting a very heavy raid on London.

and

On the afternoon of 14 November 1940 the signal read 'ANGRIFF [attack] KORN', but the computers [i.e., the operatives] could not guess at the time and did not learn until later that KORN was the code-word for Coventry.

Battle of Wits - The complete story of codebreaking in World War II, by Stephen Budiansky:

The false but still repeated story that Churchill knew in advance of the devastating raid on Coventry planned for the night of November 14, 1940 ... credits Enigma intelligence with far more than it was providing at the time. ... The intelligence that was available to Churchill on the fourteenth, particularaly beam bearings detected late in the day, convinced him that London was indeed the target, and he even canceled a planned trip out of town, explaining to an aide when he arrived back at Downing Street that he was not going to spend a peaceful evening in the country while the metropolis was under attack. Churchill was actually scanning the skies impatiently from the roof of the Air Ministry, waiting for the German bombers to appear, when the attack on Coventry began a hundred miles away.

[Obviousman]

Okay, I was basing my information on an interview R.V. Jones gave some time ago. I'll double check, but will assume for the moment that you are correct and I was wrong about Conventry.

With regard to Australian intelligence giving warning about a Japanese fleet heading for Pearl Harbour... I can find none.

What I did find was reference to reports about non sighting of a Japanese fleet near Singapore. It was expected that Japan might attack strategic targets in the Far East and Pacific. These targets were expected to be the Philippines, Singapore, or Pearl Harbour. Any approach to Singapore was expected to be reported by commercial vessels or watching posts. There were no reports of a fleet.

If you have a reference to this Australian warning, I'd appreciate it.

[sts60]

The Delta is bigger than the Saturn V.

No, it is not. That's absolutely, inarguably wrong.

It was on TV. That's where I saw it.

Maybe you should actually make an effort to learn something rather than get all your "knowledge" from TV and the Web. Heck, the information has been handed to you here on a silver platter - no work on your part - and you're still wrong.

If the Saturn was so great they wouldn't have created the Delta Rocket.

The Delta entered service before the Saturn was even built.

If the Saturn were so great they would've used it to lauch three satellites at once;

Ludicrous. The Saturn V is a man-rated heavy-lift vehicle. It wasn't built for multiple-payload satellite launches and it would be economic and programmatic lunacy to do so. You have no idea what you're talking about.

instead they created the Delta; the mother of all satellite lauchers.

The Delta family originated before the Saturn family. But since you're fumblingly trying to discuss the Delta IV, you're even more wildly wrong than before. The DIV came decades after the S-V left service. There is no connection between the two programs. And many, many other launchers have excelled at satellite launches, including the Delta IV's primary domestic competitor, the Atlas V, and primary foreign competitor, the Ariane V. Moreover, multiple satellite launches are nothing new - they've been happening for decades.

Everything you have said is wrong. Most of what you have said is so far disconnected from reality it doesn't even get to wrong.

I repeat: don't you ever get embarrassed by spouting such ridiculous nonsense about topics of which you know nothing whatsoever?

[Bob B.]

phantomwolf said:

The Delta rocket was designed and put into production AFTER the Challenger accident in 1986.

sts60 said:

The Delta entered service before the Saturn was even built.

It seems we have a bit of a discrepancy here. It depends on which version of the Delta rocket we’re talking about. PhantomWolf is correct if we’re talking about the Delta II and later versions, however there are versions that go back much earlier.

The Delta rocket can trace its roots all the way back to the Thor missile of the 1950s. Delta was the name given to the commercial version of the military’s Thor-Delta, with Delta being the military name for the second stage. Throughout the 1960s there were many versions of the Delta launch vehicle with letter designations, i.e. Delta A, Delta B. etc. The Delta 1914 appeared in 1972 and was the first using the uprated first stage with the RS-27 engine. The Delta 2914 (1974) was based on the 1914 but used the TR-201 second stage engine based on the Apollo LM decent engine. The Delta 3914 (1976) was based on the 2914 but included uprated Caster 4 solid strap-on motors. Several more Delta configurations appeared through the 1980s. The uprated Castor 4A strap-ons first appeared on the Delta 4925 in 1989. The very familiar Delta II rocket also appeared in 1989, in the 6925 configuration, and was based on the 4925 but with an uprated first stage. The brief appearance of the Delta III began in 1998; it was based on the Delta II but with larger solid strap-ons and a new cryogenic upper stage. The first launch of a Delta IV occurred in 2002. The Delta IV is based on the entirely new cryogenic Common Booster Core (CBC), uses from 0 to 4 GEM-60 strap-ons, and includes one of two cryogenic second stages depending on the configuration. The Delta IV-Heavy uses two CBC strap-ons flanking the CBC first stage.

[sts60]

I was deliberately talking about the original Delta, since MoonMan was just throwing out whatever he Googled up, as usual. I did it to point up how he really can't tell the Delta IV from Rocket Ship Galileo, even when we put information directly into his hands.

[Moon Man]

The Delta Rocket is the rocket of the future. They will be using it to launch future Shuttles, the new age shuttles.

The Holocaust did not kill as many as your history books claim; just like the mass graves Iraq allegedly had; they don't exist. Babies weren't being tossed from incubators in 91 like Bush senior falsely reported either to suck you into war.

If the Holocaust was so bad then why did America hire so many WW11 war criminals for there Space program..?

Canada declared war on Japan right after Pearl Harbour while America waited until the next day to declare war. Why the wait..?

[hplasm]

You can go back into oblivion for another 6 months now if you like.

[echnaton]

The Holocaust did not kill as many as your history books claim;

This is kind of like the "Three time the rocket" statements earlier, except of course, we are dealing with the live of people. No evidence or understanding. Whatever your point Moon Man, it doesn't change the fact that million of Jews and other people were put to death in concentration camps by the Third Reich for no other reason than who they were. Bickering about the numbers of millions of people murdered is obscene.

Put a plug in it.

[nomuse]

I vote we don't even acknowledge his off-Apollo, neo-FSM-knows what rants. When he speaks of Apollo, we can answer.

[echnaton]

Fine with me. I've had all the conversation with MM that I care for. But discussions on Apollo is what we are here for and his dumbfounding ignorance can be amusing.